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Inspiration

Living Quietly in an Attention Economy: The Quiet Age

Elena Brower
Elena Brower
Oct 17, 2026
8 min read

From Elena Brower

Watch · 6

Cory Allen's The Quiet Age, creating a calm life in a chaotic world, is a book that behaves the way it argues. Its pages alternate white and black, its spine is lettered so you can read it while looking straight at it, and each short insight asks for a pause before the next one begins. In a long conversation with Elena Brower on her Practice You podcast, Allen traces the book to a feeling he describes as existential fatigue: a sense that attention, energy and selfhood were being harvested by systems built to keep people scrolling. What follows is a reading of that conversation, its origins, and the practical idea at its center, that slowing down is not withdrawal from the world but a deliberate act of taking back your own time. The episode runs past an hour; this piece draws on its opening conversation.

Read · 7 sections

What does a book with white and black pages ask of its reader?

The first thing Brower notices is the object itself. "I've never seen anything like it," she says, pointing out that the facing pages are white, the right-hand pages black, and that the lettering on the spine is set so the reader can take it in at a glance. That design choice matters. A conventional self-help book asks you to read; this one asks you to stop, look, and let each page register before you move on.

Brower did exactly that on air, reading from page 12 of the book:

"Learning to step back from urgency culture, page 12, isn't about ghosting the world and ignoring your responsibilities. It's about learning how to take back part of your life so you can prioritize your happiness and stop feeling so overwhelmed and undernourished."

— Elena Brower, reading from The Quiet Age on Practice You (2:34)

The sentence is worth slowing down for, because it heads off the most common misreading of a book about calm. Allen is not telling anyone to vanish. He is describing a reallocation: fewer demands on the calendar, more room for the things that actually sustain a person. Brower says the page has changed her own schedule. "I have no more than three items on my calendar a day, max," she told him. "Usually it's two." Her meals, she added, are now taken seated and quietly.

Where did The Quiet Age come from?

Allen does not describe the book as a project he sat down to write. He describes it as something that grew in him. "I think that creatively I look inside myself and what I'm experiencing and what is building," he explains. "I noticed that certain feelings and realizations start to germinate over the course of weeks and months and then sometimes years."

— Cory Allen, Practice You with Elena Brower (4:58)

Allen also treats his large social media following as a kind of instrument. Watching how people respond to posts, which language they reach for, and where different corners of culture seem to be, gave him what he calls an "interesting insight" into the moment. The book, in his telling, is a place where his private state and the public mood meet.

That private state, by his account, was fatigue. He describes feeling "existentially fatigued with where we are right now as people," and names what he sees: "the clamping down of our attentions, the harvesting of our energy, the removal of our sense of self." His phrase for the result is blunt: "monochromatic spiritual numbness." Everything, in his view, has become algorithmic and fueled by attention. Platforms pull the levers that keep people engaged, and those levers work by exploiting fear, the desire to be seen, self-worth, comparison, and outrage. Even the practical logistics of ordinary life, from shopping to paying bills, now flow through the same devices.

It is a bleak diagnosis, but Allen's framing is less despairing than it first sounds, because it locates the problem in a pattern rather than in individual weakness. Once you see that the machinery is designed around your attention, you can stop mistaking its pull for your own preferences.

Why does Allen describe technology as a tide we can step out of?

Allen places the present moment inside a longer historical arc. "Technology has been collapsing in on itself for the last 100 years," he argues, moving through the industrial age, the electronic age and the digital age. Each wave promised to serve human life and in many ways did, but each also grew more capable of shaping that life on its own terms.

His conclusion is the hinge of the book's title and purpose. This, he says, is the first moment in that sequence when people need to take an active role rather than drift along. "No. I'm not going to be swept into the tide of this compression of life anymore," is how he frames the decision.

This is a musician's kind of argument, if you think about it. Anyone who has played in a band knows that a groove doesn't stop because you want it to. You either lock into a different pulse or you get carried by the one already in the room. A quiet age, as Allen uses the term, is a deliberate choice of pulse.

Can a ring help you come back to the moment?

The conversation turns practical when Allen describes Pulse, a company he co-owns that he credits with creating the first mindfulness smart ring. The device does one thing: it vibrates gently, with several modes available. Its purpose, as Allen puts it, is to bring attention back to the present and interrupt autopilot. "You just have this gentle little friend giving you a nudge," he says, "once an hour or three times an hour or whatever."

— Cory Allen, Practice You with Elena Brower (8:49)

Brower, who wears one, reports that the nudges have produced an unexpected result. Her ring tells her to go for a walk when it's the golden hour, and she goes. She calls the connection to her device "insane" and says she is learning to choose more carefully which parts of her digital life she connects to. Allen's response is the simplest version of the book's logic: "I just need to be tapped on the shoulder to be helped kind of wake up out of all of this."

There is a useful caution in that exchange. A tool that reminds you to be present is still a tool that runs on your attention, so its value depends entirely on what it returns you to. In Brower's experience, it returned her to the outdoors. That is the test any practice of this kind has to pass.

What does a reset look like in practice?

Much of the conversation concerns the idea of a reset, and Allen is clear that it is not instant. Around the 40-minute mark, the discussion turns to the time it takes to change long-established habits, and his point is that the process needs patience rather than a single dramatic decision.

— Cory Allen, Practice You with Elena Brower (40:31)

Brower's own example illustrates the point. Her calendar, which she describes as having been completely remade since she returned home, is now sparse enough that days feel "so much more spacious and alive." The change did not come from a single resolution. It came from reading one page, letting it register, and then acting on what it revealed about her existing commitments.

This is where the book's modest, page-by-page format earns its keep. Each insight is small enough to live with for a day. A reader who takes one page at a time is practicing the same rhythm the book describes: a little space, a little reflection, then the next step.

Why does silence carry so much weight in this conversation?

Brower frames the conversation with a recent experience. She had just finished a 10-day Vipassana retreat, and she notes that the assistant teachers were Diego Perez, also known as Young Pablo, and his wife Sarah. She came to the interview, she says, with "a great deal of reverence and care and intentionality and also quiet." That context shapes how the two of them talk about the book. Silence is not an accessory to Allen's ideas; it is the ground they grow from.

Later in the episode, Allen speaks to the value of knowing when silence should do the talking. "Knowing when to let your silence say" is the kind of guidance that threads through the conversation, even where the transcript breaks off mid-sentence.

— Cory Allen, Practice You with Elena Brower (56:30)

The point for a reader is not to adopt a retreat schedule. It is to notice where your own speech, scrolling or reaction runs ahead of your awareness, and to let a pause do some of the work. The book's black and white pages make that pause physical.

Where to go from here

If the conversation has stirred something, the most direct step is the book itself, which Allen describes as built to be read slowly and returned to. Its publisher page is at https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/The-Quiet-Age/Cory-Allen/9798881609849. Brower's earlier conversations with Allen, from episode 196 and a companion written piece, are available at https://elenabrower.com/episode-196-cory-allen/ and https://elenabrower.substack.com/p/live-with-cory-allen.

Start small. Take one page a day, as Brower suggests she did, and see what it changes on your calendar before you try to change everything. The quiet age Allen describes is not a place you arrive at. It is a pulse you choose to lock into, one hour and one page at a time.

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Transcript

[0:00] Welcome to the Practice You podcast. My

[0:03] name is Elena Brower.

[0:06] >> [music]

[0:11] [music]

[0:12] >> Let's dive into today's conversation

[0:15] regarding life's myriad transitions and

[0:18] how we refine our responses

[0:21] in our [music] relationships, our

[0:23] wellness, our households, our work, and

[0:25] in our practices.

[0:27] You are invited to learn and love

[0:30] >> [music]

[0:30] >> and listen with me. Welcome to Practice

[0:33] You.

[0:41] Welcome back to the podcast. I have a

[0:44] returning guest, a glorious human whom I

[0:47] respect and admire greatly. His name is

[0:49] Cory Allen. His new book is called The

[0:52] Quiet Age, creating a calm life in a

[0:56] chaotic world.

[0:58] Cory, it is so nice to welcome you back.

[1:00] I'll get to your bio, but I just want to

[1:02] say welcome back to the podcast and

[1:04] thank you for your time.

[1:05] >> It's so nice to be back. Thank you so

[1:07] much for having me. I'm I've really been

[1:08] looking forward to hanging out with you

[1:11] again today.

[1:12] >> Yeah, we've had a podcast together here

[1:16] some many months ago. We even had a

[1:19] really sweet talk for the launch of my

[1:20] book called Nothing some months ago,

[1:22] which I'll include in the show notes,

[1:24] too, cuz it's so nice.

[1:26] You're an author, mindfulness expert,

[1:29] speaker, you're a podcast host of your

[1:31] own, helping people slow down, think

[1:33] clearly,

[1:35] and live with intention.

[1:37] You're a daily meditator for over 25

[1:39] years. Your words reach millions of

[1:41] people each week on Instagram.

[1:44] And your daily insights have become a

[1:46] trusted source of clarity in an

[1:48] overstimulated world.

[1:50] Reading your book and being your friend

[1:53] and also having just emerged from my

[1:55] first 10-day Vipassana with

[1:58] Diego Perez, also known as Young Pablo,

[2:01] our dear mutual friend, and his wife

[2:03] Sarah.

[2:05] Both of them were the assistant teachers

[2:07] on this 10 day Vipassana.

[2:09] So, I'm coming into this interview,

[2:11] Corey, with

[2:13] a great deal of reverence and care and

[2:16] intentionality and also quiet.

[2:19] It is such a joy to be talking about

[2:22] this book because it is in fact a force

[2:25] of quiet. And dear listeners, you open

[2:28] the book, you'll find facing pages are

[2:31] white and the sort of main pages on the

[2:34] right are black.

[2:35] And as you turn the pages, the pages are

[2:39] deeply simple.

[2:41] Um I've sent a copy to my kid as well

[2:44] so that he can just read one page a day

[2:47] or I send pictures of the pages if I

[2:49] feel like it. Each insight,

[2:52] and I'm going to read a few right now,

[2:54] provide worlds of space for us in our

[2:58] minds and our bodies and our hearts and

[3:00] our emotions and our relations.

[3:02] And I'll start to share them with you

[3:04] now.

[3:05] Learning to step back from urgency

[3:07] culture, page 12,

[3:09] isn't about ghosting the world and

[3:12] ignoring your responsibilities.

[3:14] It's about learning how to take back

[3:16] part of your life so you can prioritize

[3:19] your happiness and stop feeling so

[3:21] overwhelmed and undernourished.

[3:25] That one has been walking with me

[3:27] as I have completely refabricated my

[3:29] calendar since I got home.

[3:32] I have no more than three items on my

[3:34] calendar a day, max. Usually it's two.

[3:38] Today it's two.

[3:40] The days are so much more spacious and

[3:42] alive. My meals are actually taken

[3:45] seated quietly.

[3:48] You have uh with this one page of this

[3:51] book, you've effectively helped me

[3:54] change everything about the way that I'm

[3:56] living my life right now on a daily

[3:57] basis, and I want to thank you, Cory,

[3:59] for that.

[3:59] >> Mhm, that's beautiful. Well, thank you

[4:01] for reading and also just making those

[4:05] changes in your life and experiencing

[4:07] what was there waiting for you to

[4:09] experience it.

[4:10] >> Yep. Thank you. How did this book come

[4:13] to life? It's so very particular. I've

[4:16] never seen anything like it. Even the

[4:18] spine of the book and the words are not

[4:21] written sideways. When I look at the

[4:22] spine, the words are written so that I

[4:24] can read it when I'm staring at the

[4:26] spine.

[4:27] Just tell me a little bit about this.

[4:29] How are you working with Andrews McMeel?

[4:31] It's been such a joy to work with them

[4:32] in the past. Tell me everything.

[4:35] >> Yeah, well, I'm glad that you noticed

[4:36] the spine aspect. Thank you for that and

[4:39] thank you for just all the kind words.

[4:41] It came about because

[4:45] I think that creatively I look inside

[4:48] myself and what I'm experiencing and

[4:51] what is building.

[4:53] I noticed that certain feelings and

[4:56] realizations

[4:58] start to germinate over the course of

[5:01] weeks and months and then sometimes

[5:02] years.

[5:04] And then because I'm a curious fellow, I

[5:07] also look at

[5:09] the waves that are moving through

[5:11] culture and having a large social media

[5:14] following

[5:15] gives you an interesting insight into

[5:17] that because you can see

[5:19] how people are responding to things,

[5:21] what language people are using, and see

[5:23] some patterns of kind of where certain

[5:26] sectors of culture are at. And I tend to

[5:31] get curious about where I'm at and what

[5:34] I'm feeling and where people

[5:37] [clears throat] are at in general

[5:39] and how those things are connected.

[5:42] And that's usually where a lot of the

[5:44] writing comes from.

[5:47] In this case,

[5:48] I started feeling myself several years

[5:50] ago

[5:52] just exhausted

[5:55] and I think existentially fatigued

[6:00] with where we are right now as people.

[6:05] And by that I mean the clamping down of

[6:09] >> [snorts]

[6:09] >> our attentions,

[6:11] the harvesting of our energy,

[6:14] the

[6:15] removal of our sense of self because

[6:18] [snorts] we're all getting pulled into

[6:20] this machinery

[6:23] of

[6:25] monochromatic

[6:26] spiritual

[6:29] numbness is I guess the best way I can

[6:31] put it.

[6:32] It's like everything is

[6:35] so algorithmic

[6:37] and charged by the fuel of our

[6:42] attention.

[6:43] And so to trigger our attention,

[6:47] the people who are in charge of these

[6:49] platforms and just kind of the digital

[6:51] world and news cycles and everything

[6:53] that's controlling our lives right now

[6:55] are pulling every lever to keep us

[6:58] engaged. And that can look like

[7:02] exploiting our fear, exploiting our

[7:04] dreams, exploiting our lack of

[7:07] self-worth, our need to compare

[7:08] ourselves, exploiting our outrage,

[7:12] manipulating our values,

[7:14] putting us up against other people with

[7:17] polarizing values so that we become

[7:20] angry and need to

[7:22] vindicate our view of the world.

[7:25] And then if you add the way that the

[7:29] logistics of being human have also been

[7:31] absorbed into the same machinery,

[7:34] you have everything in your life from

[7:38] shopping to

[7:40] just you know, dealing with bills to you

[7:43] name it is all coming through your

[7:46] device.

[7:47] >> My ultra-human ring that I love a lot,

[7:50] which is new,

[7:52] has me now, in some twist of irony,

[7:56] getting outside more.

[7:58] It tells me, "Go. Go for a walk. Right

[8:00] now, it's the golden hour." And I go.

[8:03] So, to your point, there is this insane

[8:06] connection to the device. I'm learning

[8:08] how to choose very carefully what parts

[8:10] I'm connecting to, but you're 1,000% on

[8:14] the money, and I just know that your

[8:16] book is going to help us deal with it

[8:18] and mitigate [clears throat] it.

[8:19] >> Thank you. Yes, I'm a co-owner of a

[8:21] company called Pulse, which is created

[8:24] the first mindfulness smart ring. And it

[8:27] is basically a ring that vibrates very

[8:31] gently. It has a bunch of different

[8:33] modes that you can use, but that's its

[8:36] sole functionality is like a gentle

[8:38] vibration.

[8:39] And the device that you just mentioned

[8:42] reminds you to go outside. That's the

[8:44] thing that we need, you know, then why I

[8:46] was interested in being a part of the

[8:48] company

[8:49] is because it just reminds you, "Hey,

[8:52] bring your attention back to this

[8:53] moment. Get out of the autopilot that

[8:56] you're in. Go outside, take a breath, do

[8:59] whatever." But you just have this gentle

[9:00] little friend giving you a nudge, you

[9:03] know, once an hour or three times an

[9:04] hour or whatever, which hopefully, you

[9:07] know, is serving a similar purpose. Cuz

[9:10] I just need to be tapped on the shoulder

[9:12] to be helped kind of wake up out of all

[9:13] of this.

[9:14] Yeah, so I was noticing, you know,

[9:17] obviously looking at all of this,

[9:19] and then noticing how I felt just

[9:23] increasingly

[9:25] tired and numb [clears throat]

[9:28] and bored and flat

[9:33] and just exhausted by the whole

[9:36] state of how are operating now.

[9:40] And I thought, you know what? Technology

[9:42] has been collapsing in on itself for the

[9:44] last 100 years.

[9:46] We've gone through, you know, the

[9:48] industrial age, the electronic age, the

[9:51] digital age. I thought, this is the

[9:53] first moment where

[9:54] instead of letting technology continue

[9:57] to increase and control our lives,

[10:01] this is the first time that we need to

[10:03] play an active role in that and say,

[10:06] "No.

[10:07] I'm not going to be swept into the tide

[10:11] of this compression of life anymore."

[10:14] And that's where the name of the book

[10:15] came from. It's time for a quiet age.

[10:18] But the difference is that we have to be

[10:20] the ones to consciously and

[10:23] intentionally build that quiet and that

[10:25] spaciousness back into our lives,

[10:28] or else it's going to be continued to be

[10:30] sucked out of us

[10:32] until we're living a completely just

[10:36] autonomous singularity of digital chaos.

[10:40] And so, I wrote this book to not only

[10:43] create a gap that helps create some

[10:46] space in the autopilot, in the reactive

[10:48] living, in the exhaustion,

[10:50] but then addresses linearly all of the

[10:53] stuff that comes along with that,

[10:54] because a lot of people think, "All

[10:56] right, well, I've been in survival mode

[11:00] and just been reactive and I've been

[11:01] slowly normalizing all of this stress

[11:04] and all this tension and reactivity

[11:06] because of digital life.

[11:08] And so, I'm just going to stop and slow

[11:09] down, maybe, you know, for 10 minutes a

[11:11] day, I'm going to relax and then things

[11:13] will be fine."

[11:14] But the reality is so much deeper than

[11:16] that. Because the reason why we're

[11:18] reacting, the reason why we're on

[11:20] autopilot, the reason why we're

[11:21] disassociating through work or

[11:24] relationships or over-socialization or

[11:26] substances or whatever it is, it's

[11:29] because we're really trying to outrun

[11:31] the deeper pain and discomfort that's

[11:34] underneath all of that stuff.

[11:36] >> [snorts]

[11:36] >> And so when if we slow down and we get

[11:38] some quiet,

[11:39] now we're left to feel ourselves again.

[11:43] And in that is going to be a little

[11:44] discomfort. And so I talk about that,

[11:47] how to address those things, how to

[11:49] re-pattern our behavior, and then

[11:50] re-enter the world understanding that

[11:53] the world will always be chaos, but it's

[11:56] not about trying to fix that. It's about

[11:58] trying to change your internal

[12:00] relationship with how you engage with

[12:03] life.

[12:05] >> Yeah. [sighs and gasps]

[12:06] What I think I'm hearing the most of all

[12:09] is that there is for each of us the root

[12:12] cause of why we've chosen to sign on

[12:17] for the chaos.

[12:19] For each of us it's a different thing.

[12:20] For me, it was a great deal of sadness

[12:22] that had turned into anger that I was

[12:25] turning on so many people in my life and

[12:28] creating real chaos in my own world. And

[12:32] then becoming a workaholic.

[12:34] Straight up. Like just overworking

[12:37] so many things that I don't need to be

[12:39] doing that I was doing. And over the

[12:41] last maybe 3 years, I've committed to

[12:44] ridding myself, transforming the anger

[12:47] that I felt at the depth of my being

[12:49] that I saw again in Vipassanā

[12:52] so clearly over those 10 days. Handing

[12:55] in my phone,

[12:56] seeing how fast my mind goes to wanting

[13:00] to solve a problem, fix a thing, get

[13:03] something done, produce

[13:05] in Idaho, Lava Hot [clears throat]

[13:08] Springs, where there's nothing doing.

[13:11] Nothing doing. You're just sitting 10

[13:13] hours a day,

[13:14] eating a couple times, walking, walking,

[13:17] walking.

[13:18] To watch all of that really showed me

[13:21] that to your point, each of us has a

[13:23] certain way of coping.

[13:25] Most of us have taken that root problem

[13:27] and made it into

[13:29] overdoing something.

[13:31] If you're listening to this, what is

[13:33] yours? Say it out loud. Be proud and be

[13:36] free. Say it out loud.

[13:38] Mine is some combination of work, buying

[13:41] things that I don't need.

[13:43] That's now largely gone. And a form of

[13:47] anger

[13:48] that was very, very deeply seated in my

[13:51] body that is now moving. I can feel it

[13:53] every time I sit.

[13:55] I'd love to know Cory from you what your

[13:57] findings have been personally if you're

[13:59] willing to share along those lines. What

[14:02] is the root? What is the manifestation?

[14:05] And I think committing to the quiet age

[14:08] is what the sort of inquiry and ask is.

[14:12] I'm committing to the quiet age, period.

[14:15] >> Yeah, I mean, underneath all of my

[14:19] hyper-independent

[14:21] hyper-vigilance

[14:23] and everything is just an immense amount

[14:27] of pain, disappointment, sadness

[14:31] and a feeling of being

[14:34] unlovable and unwanted

[14:36] and having no value.

[14:38] And that all comes from

[14:41] just my childhood, of course. And and

[14:44] then there's the feelings of there's

[14:46] betrayal in there as well.

[14:48] I've done a lot of work to track this

[14:50] back and

[14:53] this is I mean, we could go into some

[14:55] pretty interesting deep waters if you'd

[14:58] like. You know, we're going to exit the

[15:00] highway and get on a different highway

[15:01] for a couple minutes, but I think it

[15:04] could be particularly interesting to you

[15:06] if you want to.

[15:08] >> I'd love to. And I'm very capable of

[15:11] putting us back on the highway if we

[15:12] need to, but I'd like to take the side,

[15:14] the dirt road for a minute if we can.

[15:16] >> Okay, I think just given what you were

[15:18] telling me about your recent experience

[15:21] with the retreat, I think you might find

[15:23] this fascinating or at least

[15:24] interesting.

[15:26] So, I have always [snorts]

[15:29] since I can remember have been very

[15:32] independent and full of energy to try

[15:35] and do stuff and create things and make

[15:38] things happen, right?

[15:40] That turned into, as I mentioned

[15:42] earlier, a level of hyper-independence,

[15:44] hyper-vigilance,

[15:46] where

[15:47] I have my entire life, from the time I

[15:49] was probably like 12, have felt almost

[15:52] possessed

[15:54] to where I must create things and I must

[15:59] build and generate stuff out into the

[16:02] world. That was music whenever I was

[16:04] younger. It turned into podcasting,

[16:07] which turned into writing, and turned

[16:09] into social media.

[16:11] On honestly, now it's just the economy

[16:13] of my identity. I just am now a

[16:16] professional Corey, you know, and and

[16:18] show up in different ways, and that's

[16:19] what it is now.

[16:21] But, throughout all of that journey, you

[16:24] know, I started meditating whenever I

[16:26] was a teenager and reading, you know,

[16:28] all the books and everything.

[16:30] And

[16:31] I knew that I was, cuz of what I

[16:35] experienced, you know, in my younger

[16:36] years, there was a lot of pain, a lot of

[16:38] I experienced a lot of emotional abuse,

[16:40] a lot of

[16:41] um manipulation and trauma

[16:44] at extreme levels, and that shaped my

[16:49] personality, of course, and that's

[16:51] honestly why, one of the reasons I got

[16:53] interested in perception whenever I was

[16:55] so young, is because whenever you're

[16:58] really young and you're told that

[16:59] reality is one thing, but you've

[17:01] observed something else, I instinctively

[17:04] realized that perception is subjective,

[17:07] that we're all seeing different views of

[17:09] the world, and we're all telling each

[17:10] other different things and different

[17:13] stories about reality.

[17:15] >> [gasps]

[17:15] >> And so

[17:16] >> Little Buddha.

[17:17] >> [laughter]

[17:17] >> You're a little Buddha,

[17:19] a little Gautama under the tree.

[17:21] >> [laughter]

[17:22] >> Oh, bless you.

[17:23] >> And so, anyway, I started realizing that

[17:27] all of this work, all this meditation I

[17:29] was doing, I was using it as a tool of

[17:32] self-protection to deepen my

[17:34] understanding of the mind. And I

[17:36] realized that the more that I went into

[17:38] it, the more control and intention I had

[17:40] over who I was being in the world and

[17:43] that I could shape who I was and I could

[17:45] release and let go of the patterns, the

[17:48] reactions, some of the pain and stuff

[17:51] that I had experienced.

[17:53] And so, I spent a lifetime with this

[17:55] mixture of my hyper-independence

[18:00] and this deep, rich internal path based

[18:03] on,

[18:04] you know, the enlightenment of self and

[18:08] being

[18:09] the most [clears throat]

[18:12] compassionate person that I could be for

[18:15] others.

[18:17] And because I always took a really

[18:19] intellectual approach to everything, I

[18:20] just tried to go as deep as I possibly

[18:22] just gardening with dynamite, you know,

[18:24] I always wanted to go as deep as I

[18:25] possibly could into my mind and into

[18:28] every subject and learn everything as

[18:29] much as I could. And that kind of

[18:31] careerism, in quotes,

[18:34] got locked into not only in my

[18:35] professional life but also my inner

[18:37] pursuits.

[18:38] And one day, this is a couple of years

[18:42] ago,

[18:43] I was thinking to myself,

[18:45] whatever I was just into meditation,

[18:48] and I was like, why do I feel

[18:51] a lonely?

[18:54] Everyone says, you know, I'm the calmest

[18:55] person they know. I feel calm but not at

[18:59] ease.

[19:00] There's something deep in there, there's

[19:02] some grit, there's some sand in the

[19:04] oyster that's way down in there and I

[19:07] need to figure out what that is.

[19:09] Because

[19:11] as one might guess from what I mentioned

[19:13] earlier,

[19:14] the most important values of mine is

[19:17] honesty and truth in all of my stuff

[19:20] I've created. I don't care how

[19:23] successful it makes me. I don't care how

[19:26] my status changes. I don't care how much

[19:28] money I make. I care that it's guiding

[19:31] people away from delusion and closer to

[19:34] their own clarity. That's the goal of

[19:36] everything and that's what trumps every

[19:38] other option and possibility in my

[19:40] stuff.

[19:42] And because I have a vitriol for it

[19:44] because I grew up having that used

[19:46] against me, you know, so it's like I

[19:48] would never betray that, right? So, I

[19:51] was looking deeper and I was like, all

[19:52] right, why do I feel this loneliness?

[19:53] Why do I feel

[19:55] this detachment?

[19:57] And I thought, well, I feel like I have

[19:59] this armor

[20:01] that I'm always wearing to a degree and

[20:04] I need to figure out why and what that

[20:06] is. And so I went into meditation

[20:08] and I just thought, let me just track

[20:10] the feeling back. Let me just feel the

[20:13] feeling in my stomach, go down into it.

[20:16] And I went into it and I thought, all

[20:17] right, now what does this feel like?

[20:19] What are the kind of the notes

[20:20] [clears throat] that are arising?

[20:22] And the first one was betrayal and a lot

[20:24] of pain.

[20:26] I thought, okay, let me go and see if a

[20:28] memory might arise around that

[20:30] experience and this feeling in the

[20:31] stomach.

[20:33] And I did and it was the first time I

[20:34] expressed emotion to a parent and I was

[20:38] attacked instead of loved [snorts] and

[20:40] shown support. I was, you know,

[20:42] threatened.

[20:43] And I remembered that moment. It was

[20:46] like a a trap snapping shut

[20:49] of the [snorts] person who I thought I

[20:52] should get unconditional love from

[20:55] showed me that that was not true. So now

[20:57] I can't trust

[20:59] the world with my vulnerability and then

[21:04] I went on to learn briefly after that

[21:06] that if I ever wanted to do anything, to

[21:09] understand anything, to get anywhere, I

[21:11] only could rely on myself.

[21:13] And that's inside and outside of the

[21:15] body.

[21:16] And that's why I became just super

[21:17] self-sufficient with everything and like

[21:20] the ultimate autodidact is cuz that was

[21:22] my programming I was running.

[21:25] And so, I thought about this a lot and

[21:29] I'm not really the type to do like

[21:31] somatic uh role-playing stuff because

[21:35] I'm a real like nuts and bolts like meat

[21:37] and potatoes type of guy with this

[21:39] stuff, but I did in that moment, I sat

[21:43] with that feeling and I thought, "Okay,

[21:45] that feeling in the stomach was

[21:47] basically armor and it was trying to

[21:49] protect me in that moment, but I was a

[21:52] kid, I needed it then, I'm a gigantic

[21:56] bald adult now, I don't need that

[21:58] anymore. I can [laughter] take care of

[21:59] myself."

[22:01] >> [gasps]

[22:01] >> And I just let it release and visually

[22:05] just kind of turned into ash and flew

[22:08] away.

[22:09] But then, I thought deeply about, "Okay,

[22:12] now I realize I was carrying this

[22:15] protection, but how is this manifested

[22:18] into this feeling of disconnection and

[22:21] isolation?"

[22:23] >> Loneliness.

[22:23] >> And loneliness, yeah.

[22:25] And I realized it's because I, without

[22:29] realizing it, had used like all the time

[22:32] I was using my meditation and all of my

[22:35] mindful training,

[22:37] >> [snorts]

[22:38] >> and I mean self-training, those things

[22:40] were all used for the most honest

[22:44] and [clears throat]

[22:46] earnest way I could.

[22:48] So, what I'll say next is nothing to say

[22:52] that all of those pursuits weren't

[22:54] sincere and for the goal of compassion

[22:58] and self-redemption, they truly were,

[23:01] but I realized there was a secondary

[23:03] level program running.

[23:05] And that secondary level program

[23:08] was that I was using

[23:11] mindfulness and my meditative awareness

[23:14] to facilitate

[23:17] a controllable

[23:19] version of reality.

[23:21] Because ultimately at the end of the

[23:23] day, mindfulness is really just

[23:25] self-monitoring.

[23:27] You know, people like to dress it up and

[23:29] it has a lot of outcomes, but ultimately

[23:32] it is paying attention to what you're

[23:34] doing and saying as you're doing it so

[23:37] that what you express into the world and

[23:39] towards others is intentional instead of

[23:42] reactive. That's really the nuts and

[23:45] bolts of it.

[23:46] >> Yep, fair.

[23:47] >> And I realized that

[23:49] what I was doing or without realizing

[23:52] it, I was creating

[23:54] this social ecosystem

[23:57] where who I was, I was always charming

[24:02] and curious and was a very deep listener

[24:06] and would really like just melt

[24:08] consciousnesses with people to

[24:10] understand them deeply and to share my

[24:14] insights from my life with what they

[24:16] were telling me to make them feel

[24:18] connected and to excite them and to

[24:21] expand their minds and to make them feel

[24:24] a little bedazzled and warm and fuzzy

[24:27] and all of this stuff. And I thought,

[24:29] well, if people seem to really like me,

[24:32] you know, people come up and everyone

[24:33] wants to talk to me all the time and

[24:36] people often tell me even social

[24:38] situations like this is one of the most

[24:39] amazing conversations I've ever had and

[24:42] yada yada. I'm like, that makes sense. I

[24:43] mean, that should mean that I'm being a

[24:45] good person in the world. It's like,

[24:47] well, of course I am, but the secondary

[24:49] game I'm setting up is that I was using

[24:52] that mindful awareness and the

[24:54] meditative sense of self-awareness of

[24:58] the objective sense of the world to

[25:00] create a container

[25:02] to where I could be this part of me, who

[25:06] I truly am, that very affable, warm,

[25:10] loving, kind, and very deep listening

[25:12] and deep caring and deep loving person.

[25:16] But next to that I made it to where if

[25:19] I'm being that person, that takes up so

[25:21] much space

[25:23] in the room and in the ecosystem

[25:26] that I never have to be vulnerable.

[25:30] I don't have to open up and really share

[25:32] what is two layers beneath the surface.

[25:35] I can share some of my experience or

[25:38] what I'm maybe thinking or feeling, but

[25:40] the real stuff that's down in there

[25:43] I don't have to let anyone see.

[25:46] And it was fascinating to me that I

[25:48] discovered and just realized that wow, I

[25:50] was using

[25:52] that immense strength of self-control

[25:57] as a way to create a distance

[26:01] between myself and other people so I

[26:03] could be protected.

[26:04] >> When equanimity becomes a weapon.

[26:06] >> That's right. [laughter]

[26:09] >> Details [gasps]

[26:09] at 11.

[26:11] >> That's right. Well, that's what happens.

[26:13] I joke about growing up with a lot of

[26:14] self-confidence but no self-worth. You

[26:16] know, so figure that one out, you know.

[26:18] >> [snorts]

[26:18] >> Um

[26:19] >> [sighs]

[26:20] >> Yeah.

[26:21] When I recognized that, I thought, okay,

[26:23] well, this has to change. And so

[26:25] for anyone listening to this that might

[26:27] feel a little bit similarly

[26:29] I

[26:31] thought, well, first off, I need to

[26:33] really just tune back into a felt sense

[26:36] of myself and the world because I've

[26:38] just been kind of ignoring my deeper

[26:40] emotions for a long time because they're

[26:41] so painful.

[26:43] And so I started doing what I called

[26:45] microdosing emotions. I wouldn't just

[26:48] blurt out everything I'm feeling and

[26:50] kind of the deeper, less pretty stuff or

[26:53] the stuff that just makes you human. I

[26:55] wouldn't blurt that out to people, but I

[26:57] would just share like someone says, "Oh,

[26:59] how are you doing today?" Instead of

[27:00] like, "Oh, I'm great, you know, how are

[27:01] you?" I would say, "Oh, yeah, it's I've

[27:03] kind of been tired and was feeling

[27:05] really stressed earlier, but I'm happy

[27:06] to be here with you now." You know,

[27:08] something that simple just to let out a

[27:10] little tendril of that authentic, deeper

[27:14] part of the vulnerable self to connect

[27:16] to the world. And slowly through working

[27:18] with that, I really was able to expand

[27:22] and reconnect the deeper layers of

[27:25] emotional self and vulnerability to the

[27:28] open relational self and find the

[27:31] balance

[27:32] that I needed. And what's amazing and no

[27:35] surprise is that over the last couple of

[27:37] years,

[27:38] I've had so much more growth and

[27:41] advancement, a level of acceptance and

[27:45] just comfort

[27:47] in who I am

[27:48] because, you know, my goal is to be a

[27:50] full spectrum human. You know, I want

[27:52] all of the stuff that's in me to be

[27:54] connected, to be working, and to be

[27:56] relaying with with the world and other

[27:59] people. And after working through that,

[28:01] I realized that that's where I am now

[28:04] and it and it's been really beautiful

[28:06] and also it's been difficult in moments

[28:09] because

[28:10] the excitement and the sort of

[28:13] >> [clears throat]

[28:13] >> um

[28:15] I know I'm talking a lot and just laying

[28:17] out here, but I just I just so much of

[28:18] this I feel like you might relate to it.

[28:20] It's like

[28:20] >> Yes, please. I can just promise you and

[28:23] confirm and affirm

[28:25] that everything that you've just said

[28:26] regarding your level of comfort and ease

[28:28] in the world, your level of acceptance

[28:30] of yourself, and even feeling accepted

[28:33] by others

[28:34] is a true story. We can all see it,

[28:36] those of us who are close to you and

[28:38] your work.

[28:39] It's a true story because this little

[28:41] sort of microdosing practice,

[28:43] microdosing your emotions for

[28:44] authenticity is

[28:47] a way for us to get to know you.

[28:48] >> Mhm. [clears throat]

[28:49] >> We knew your mind before. We knew your

[28:51] practice before. Now we know your heart.

[28:55] >> That's very well said.

[28:57] Very well said.

[28:59] Yeah, that is an interesting thing is

[29:01] people have told me similar stuff to

[29:04] that is they're like, yeah, like I

[29:05] always knew you and what you even

[29:07] thought but I just I didn't really know

[29:09] you in a weird way. [laughter]

[29:12] Yeah, so then this is even the last like

[29:15] month or two. I was had this thought you

[29:18] and I both been doing this stuff

[29:19] forever.

[29:20] And there's people with my podcast that

[29:23] have been listening for over a decade,

[29:25] which is weird cuz now they're in their

[29:27] mid-20s or late 20s and they're like,

[29:29] oh, I started listening when I was 17

[29:31] and now I'm 27.

[29:33] >> [gasps]

[29:34] >> And yeah, it's tripping.

[29:36] >> That's that you can be proud of that.

[29:37] You know, that's an influence

[29:38] [clears throat] that will never you'll

[29:40] never be said that you had that

[29:42] influence on a younger kid.

[29:43] >> Yeah, much different than a viral

[29:45] Instagram post. That's for sure.

[29:47] [laughter]

[29:48] >> [gasps]

[29:48] >> The quiet age is on its way to my kids

[29:50] house in California.

[29:53] So you know, for launch day, it's right

[29:54] around his birthday and he and his

[29:56] friends all got copies of Brave New You.

[29:59] >> Mhm. Amazing.

[30:01] >> Amazing. That's so sweet of you.

[30:04] >> A couple years ago. Okay, go on. Sorry.

[30:05] >> Yeah, no, no. So I had this thought of

[30:08] like

[30:09] just because of the outcome of a lot of

[30:12] that stuff I was just talking about

[30:15] I was like, my energy is a little bit

[30:17] different. I was always calm and and

[30:19] pretty placid but now there's kind of

[30:21] this

[30:23] I feel like nobody now.

[30:25] Like I feel like I used to be somebody.

[30:27] I used to be like tap dancing and trying

[30:30] to charming people and beings uh

[30:32] clever and say things in a way that were

[30:36] really beautiful and poetic. And all of

[30:38] that stuff just stopped

[30:41] >> [snorts]

[30:41] >> because that was all machinery

[30:44] to perform the identity [clears throat]

[30:47] in a way to keep people kind of enamored

[30:50] and give them something

[30:52] as opposed to just giving them who I am

[30:55] without trying, without effort, and

[30:57] without the pizzazz, you know, the

[31:00] entertainment.

[31:01] >> [snorts]

[31:01] >> And allowing them to find who they are

[31:03] through

[31:04] the example that you're setting.

[31:06] >> Yes. Yes. And so I had this funny

[31:09] thought is I've been believing that was

[31:12] the course, right? That that was what

[31:14] was happening.

[31:15] And I had this thought the other day, or

[31:17] a couple weeks ago, I think, where I was

[31:19] like

[31:20] is that it, or have I lost it?

[31:23] Have I lost my magic touch? Am I no

[31:26] longer interesting? Am I no longer

[31:30] full of wisdom? Because I don't feel

[31:32] like I have insights anymore. Right?

[31:35] Like I used to always be like, I've got

[31:36] all this material, I've got all these

[31:37] thoughts, I've got all this stuff lined

[31:39] up in my brain, and all I've been

[31:40] thinking about all this stuff.

[31:42] I don't feel like that anymore. I don't

[31:43] write notes anymore. I don't do

[31:45] anything. I just talk about what I'm

[31:46] thinking, what I'm feeling in the

[31:48] moment. And I thought, did I lose my

[31:50] magic touch? Are people going to be

[31:52] interested in my work? Am I boring now?

[31:55] Am I no longer the person that they go,

[31:57] "Ooh, that's Corey Allen. He's this and

[31:59] that and that." My wife would meet

[32:01] people randomly just in her life

[32:03] whenever she was working or traveling

[32:05] for stuff, and they would learn that I

[32:07] was her husband, and they would go, "Oh

[32:09] my god, is that Corey Allen?" She's

[32:11] like, "Yeah." And they're like, "What's

[32:12] that like?" And she's like,

[32:14] "Uh it's fine, you know, he's a

[32:16] >> [laughter]

[32:16] >> great guy."

[32:17] But now I'm like, "Ooh, is that guy

[32:18] gone, you know?"

[32:20] And I actually mentioned that to my

[32:22] wife. I said, "Let me throw something

[32:23] weird at you.

[32:25] What do you think about this?" And she

[32:27] was like, "No. Look at your life over

[32:31] the last 2 years.

[32:32] You've never been more successful.

[32:35] You've never reached more people. You've

[32:36] never been more authentic and like the

[32:40] heart of all of the work that you've

[32:41] been doing is like finally coming to

[32:43] roost in a way

[32:45] that is like really meaningful.

[32:48] And I thought, "Okay, that's what I

[32:50] thought." You know,

[32:52] >> [laughter]

[32:52] >> and then I was doing some work with

[32:54] someone

[32:55] some kind of coaching and mentoring work

[32:58] and he's a younger guy, you know, that's

[33:00] been listening to my stuff for a long

[33:02] time

[33:03] and he randomly said, "You know,

[33:05] whenever I'm depressed or feeling down,

[33:07] I just go back and listen to the

[33:08] earliest episodes of your podcast

[33:10] [laughter]

[33:11] cuz those are the ones that really,

[33:12] really make me feel just

[33:15] I just feel so cozy with them." And I

[33:17] had to laugh at the irony of that, you

[33:19] know.

[33:20] >> Well, the irony is

[33:22] that actually has nothing to do with

[33:24] you, the caliber of your work, or the

[33:25] quality of your trajectory, your

[33:28] evolution. What it has to do with is

[33:30] it's like me hearing the Brady Bunch

[33:32] theme or the MASH theme. Suddenly, I'm

[33:34] just a kid again and I'm sitting on my

[33:36] couch and my mom is nearby and

[33:37] everything is fine.

[33:39] He's going back to a time when he was

[33:41] really in a place of discovery and

[33:45] innocence,

[33:46] beginnings, you know, so it doesn't

[33:48] speak to you at all.

[33:50] It's sweet,

[33:52] but it doesn't speak to you.

[33:53] >> Yeah.

[33:54] >> What I will say is I've noticed,

[33:56] similarly to your wife, the

[33:58] not just the numbers per se, although

[34:00] it's hard to miss,

[34:02] but just the naturalness of the

[34:04] transmissions.

[34:06] And

[34:07] right now I'm going to feed you back

[34:09] your own teaching, brother.

[34:10] Page 211. Keep putting your good energy

[34:13] into the world. It's helping people

[34:16] around you more than you know.

[34:19] >> [laughter]

[34:20] >> There are five chapters in here. I know

[34:22] we're going a little bit long, but I'm

[34:23] going to finish up soon, I promise. Five

[34:25] chapters for our listener.

[34:28] Just in case you're wondering if you

[34:29] need to order this book, I'm telling you

[34:31] you do.

[34:32] Reset is the first.

[34:35] Slow is the second.

[34:38] Discover

[34:39] the third.

[34:41] Become

[34:42] is the fourth, and the fifth and final

[34:44] is arise.

[34:47] What I'd like to share with you and and

[34:49] actually to ask your permission cuz I

[34:50] haven't started yet, but I would like to

[34:52] use some of these quotes in my Glo

[34:55] classes.

[34:56] I teach online

[34:59] um for the last 15 or so years on

[35:01] glo.com.

[35:03] It's some of my favorite work, you know,

[35:05] it keeps me on the mat and keeps me sort

[35:08] of offering the best of what I

[35:10] understand in my own asana practice as

[35:13] it supports my meditation practice

[35:15] to a really broad audience who are

[35:17] basically growing up with me, you know,

[35:19] these last 15 years.

[35:22] Is it okay with you if I quote you and

[35:23] say Cory Allen's book, The Quiet Age,

[35:26] "Keep putting your good energy out into

[35:28] the world. It's helping people more than

[35:30] you know." or "Your nervous system is a

[35:32] better compass than anyone else's

[35:34] opinion." Is that okay?

[35:35] >> Of course. Of course, please. Spread the

[35:38] words.

[35:39] >> I think it's really important and the

[35:40] way that I teach is such that I just

[35:43] offer the most pithy, potent sort of

[35:46] teaching or sentiment at the beginning

[35:48] and the end of class and I sort of

[35:49] thread it through

[35:51] in a subtle but also present way. And I

[35:53] think these teachings here in this book

[35:55] are going to be very pivotal to the next

[35:58] wave of my classes. So, thank you for

[36:00] that.

[36:01] >> Mhm, [clears throat] yes, of course.

[36:02] Thank you.

[36:03] >> Uh talk to us about the trajectory of

[36:05] the book, these reset, slow, discover,

[36:08] become, arise. If you have any sort of

[36:11] offerings on that, we'd love to hear.

[36:14] >> Oh, yeah. So,

[36:16] going back a little bit to the creation,

[36:19] you mentioned the spine and I wanted to

[36:21] touch on that and

[36:22] you know, the point is I wanted this

[36:24] book to feel like out of time almost. I

[36:28] wanted the physical nature of it, if you

[36:30] would

[36:30] >> [clears throat]

[36:31] >> Yes,

[36:32] because books used to be like this.

[36:34] >> That's right.

[36:35] >> Oh my god.

[36:37] >> Yeah.

[36:38] >> What inspired you? Hold on. What book?

[36:40] What led you to this realization that

[36:42] older books had spines reading

[36:45] vertically, not horizontally?

[36:47] >> Um

[36:49] it was honestly it was my wife and I

[36:50] just looking at it and talking about the

[36:52] aesthetic.

[36:53] And I designed the cover and I designed

[36:56] the interior and everything.

[36:58] And we were talking about the spine and

[37:00] I was like, this book needs to feel

[37:03] like timeless, because that's how it's

[37:06] going to feel

[37:07] the most present and the way to

[37:11] overcome

[37:13] our algorithmic

[37:15] churning sort of cycle in that we live

[37:18] in is to create an object that just

[37:20] ignores the rules of the game that

[37:22] they're playing.

[37:24] And we were looking at this, we're like,

[37:27] you know what? This looks like one of

[37:30] those ancient books that you'd go into a

[37:33] library and you you pull it off the

[37:35] shelf,

[37:36] but you don't ever turn your head when

[37:38] you're in a library full of like

[37:41] these timeless dusty sort of uh

[37:45] >> musty

[37:46] >> sacred book Yeah, yeah, they they never

[37:48] looked like that. Yeah, and so this

[37:51] vertical thing, they're having the

[37:53] horizontal, yeah, it just gave it that

[37:55] feel.

[37:56] >> It was the first thing I noticed when

[37:58] the book arrived to me and I thought, oh

[38:00] my goodness, and nothing on the back.

[38:02] Just

[38:03] >> just a quote.

[38:04] >> quote. This is what's on the back, dear

[38:06] listener. A quiet life is not an empty

[38:08] life.

[38:10] It is a life of depth, meaning,

[38:12] and the things that truly matter.

[38:15] >> [snorts]

[38:16] >> Yes, and I asked them to all of the

[38:19] publishing information and everything,

[38:21] that was totally designed differently.

[38:24] They had that vertically on the on the

[38:26] back of the book I said no no no. I'd

[38:28] love to take it off but I know you all

[38:30] want to have it on there. I was like

[38:31] shrink it move it out of the way. And

[38:33] also you'll probably notice there are no

[38:35] blurbs in the book.

[38:36] >> No.

[38:37] >> There's no uh no one recommending it.

[38:40] There's no other authors saying hey this

[38:42] is what I think of the book.

[38:44] There's no nothing because the whole

[38:46] point is to have the least amount of

[38:49] pressure on your nervous system and the

[38:52] least amount of association going into

[38:55] it. Cuz it's just about you and where

[38:57] you are right now not about what some

[39:00] person that has another body of work

[39:02] that you feel about says about it.

[39:04] >> It's

[39:05] it's just perfect. It's just perfect.

[39:07] >> Thank you. Thank you. And so these

[39:08] chapters reset is kind of what it means.

[39:12] It's

[39:13] thinking about where you are right now

[39:16] and deciding all right I need to reset.

[39:18] I need to step out of this

[39:21] tension and urgency and survival and

[39:24] this automation you know because urgency

[39:27] is a learned state. It's not a

[39:28] condition.

[39:30] It's just a learned state that we've all

[39:31] normalized and so reset is stepping out

[39:34] of that.

[39:35] >> Can I read one page from reset for our

[39:37] listeners so they get an

[39:39] idea? Page 47. You can move at your own

[39:42] speed and let the world bend around you.

[39:46] Or you can move at the world's pace and

[39:48] be bent by the world.

[39:51] >> [clears throat]

[39:53] [laughter]

[39:54] >> Woah. Touché pussycat. I feel like I'm

[39:57] right in the middle [clears throat] of

[39:59] changing this. I was being bent by the

[40:01] world and I'm finally learning that I'm

[40:04] moving at my own speed. I have like the

[40:07] whole day after this. I don't have

[40:09] anything else after this.

[40:11] Open skies

[40:13] and the world will work with me. I'm

[40:15] getting so many fewer emails. It's so

[40:18] great. And now you're presenting this as

[40:22] you get to choose. Dear listener, if you

[40:26] are feeling like you're being bent by

[40:28] the world, you can reset.

[40:31] And it will take time. It should take a

[40:33] lot of time. You will find the way to

[40:36] reset your system, your calendar, your

[40:39] life, your day.

[40:41] And the world will work with that.

[40:43] >> It will. It really will. And

[40:46] there's this

[40:47] I'll be honest, I don't even remember

[40:49] where it's from. I've read so many, you

[40:52] know, wisdom books over the my entire

[40:54] life. I don't even remember which one

[40:55] it's from. But the analogy that sticks

[40:58] in my mind that speaks to this that I

[41:00] always think about and I love is it said

[41:02] that the way, you know, what we're

[41:05] generally talking about here,

[41:07] the way really feels like and looks like

[41:10] an elephant walking across a lake,

[41:13] across a body of water. That's really

[41:15] what the way is. That's what it is.

[41:17] >> Wow.

[41:19] >> I think about that all the time.

[41:21] >> What a koan.

[41:22] >> Yeah.

[41:23] >> What a riddle.

[41:25] So, is it walking on the water or

[41:27] walking through the water?

[41:28] >> It's through the water. Yeah, it's

[41:30] walking because you you think about the

[41:32] elephant is big and heavy and immovable,

[41:35] but it's still flowing with life and

[41:37] life the water is flowing around it.

[41:39] It's bending, but it's the strength and

[41:42] the groundedness of the elephant that

[41:44] keeps it from being swept away.

[41:48] >> Gosh, I'm actually really stilled by

[41:51] that.

[41:52] Dear listener, this is the longest

[41:54] podcast of mine you'll ever hear, but

[41:56] >> [laughter]

[41:56] >> we're going. Um tell me [clears throat]

[41:59] about your practice.

[42:01] What does that look like these days? And

[42:03] then we're going on to the second

[42:05] chapter with a little thought from you

[42:07] and one reading.

[42:09] >> Sure. So,

[42:10] my practice these days as cliche as it

[42:14] sounds,

[42:15] so much of it is just life itself.

[42:18] I feel like that's where

[42:21] the rubber meets the road, and that's

[42:23] where I get the most out of

[42:26] the work is just in every moment that

[42:29] I'm trying my best to uphold

[42:32] what I want to be developing, and also a

[42:34] deep sense of listening and receiving.

[42:38] Because like in every conversation I

[42:40] have, in every experience I have,

[42:44] I am experiencing it.

[42:46] I am trying to let go and just be there

[42:51] with it. I'm trying to remain

[42:53] emotionally dilated and open. I'm trying

[42:56] to make sure that my stupid

[42:58] monkey brain doesn't get in the way and

[43:01] make the moment about me.

[43:04] That I can just be there and

[43:07] [clears throat] experience what is

[43:09] happening and give myself to the moment,

[43:12] but also not have it be

[43:15] this saccharine, romanticized

[43:18] saying, because that turns into

[43:20] performance.

[43:21] It's funny as it's all of that care and

[43:24] compassion minus the part of you going,

[43:27] "I'm putting so much care and compassion

[43:29] into this." [laughter]

[43:31] And then the actual practice is very

[43:34] simple. It's as we chatted a little bit

[43:36] before we started recording is that

[43:39] I was always a spiritual eclecticist

[43:41] because it's the autodidact thing. It's

[43:43] I'm going to go study and figure out

[43:44] every practice and everything and

[43:47] understand them myself.

[43:49] And [snorts] it all all of the wacky

[43:52] things that I did over the years to just

[43:54] poke and prod at my consciousness

[43:56] and try and get deep under the hood as I

[43:58] could, it's all really ended in me

[44:02] practicing something very close to

[44:04] Vipassanā, which is just sitting,

[44:07] observing the breath, and noticing

[44:09] what's arising.

[44:11] And a lot of my practice is me just not

[44:14] even paying much attention to what's

[44:17] arising, but focusing on my breathing,

[44:20] and thinking, "I'm breathing in. I'm

[44:22] aware that I'm breathing in. I'm

[44:24] breathing out. I'm aware that

[44:25] [clears throat] I'm breathing out." And

[44:27] sometimes that's even simplified to just

[44:30] rising whenever I inhale, and falling

[44:33] whenever I exhale, and then thinking

[44:35] sitting in the space between breaths.

[44:37] And I notice that all of the, you know,

[44:40] ultimately the material in our

[44:41] subconscious are

[44:43] there's so much more in there than there

[44:45] is in the conscious stage of our mind,

[44:46] because the conscious stage of our mind

[44:48] exists in language, mostly. And the

[44:51] world in our subconscious is existence

[44:54] symbols, which has a lot more

[44:55] information than words do.

[44:58] And so what happens is that in

[45:00] meditation all these different pieces of

[45:02] our subconscious container and the

[45:04] fragments of material and symbols in

[45:06] there are able to see each other,

[45:08] because spaciousness opens and there's

[45:10] clarity. They find the other pieces that

[45:12] they have been trying to connect with,

[45:14] because ultimately our brain is very

[45:17] weird, and it spends its entire life

[45:19] trying to get itself to realize things

[45:21] so that it can let go and and integrate,

[45:24] which I find hilarious.

[45:26] And so in that state, all of those

[45:28] pieces of subconscious material are able

[45:30] to find each other, connect, formulate

[45:32] into language, pass through the membrane

[45:34] into the conscious mind, and then be

[45:37] recognized and resolved. And it's sort

[45:39] of a just a rising effervescent flow.

[45:42] It's like if you open a sparkling water.

[45:44] It's like, "All right, there's all the

[45:45] bubbles. Just go do your thing, and I'll

[45:48] be here just paying attention to my

[45:49] breathing."

[45:51] That's what a lot of the practice is

[45:52] these days.

[45:53] >> Yep.

[45:55] It's nice to hear of the simplicity of

[45:58] your practice and the ease with which

[46:00] any one of us,

[46:02] dear listener, can just sit down

[46:05] and start to watch the show and then

[46:08] watch how the show gets quiet when you

[46:10] don't feed the show.

[46:11] >> Mhm. [clears throat] Mhm.

[46:12] >> The context of the simile that you

[46:15] offered us, the elephant in the lake, is

[46:18] from the Anguttara Nikaya. It's chapter

[46:20] 10, Sutta number 99.

[46:24] It falls within the same canon. It's in

[46:28] the Pali canon. The same

[46:30] >> [clears throat]

[46:30] >> Anguttara Nikaya as the five

[46:32] remembrances. I am of the nature to grow

[46:34] old. I am of the nature to die. That one

[46:36] is chapter five. Sutta 57. So, very

[46:41] interesting and the story is that the

[46:44] Buddha is trying to tell Upali, this

[46:47] monk who comes to him and says, "I want

[46:48] to move to the mountains and I want to

[46:51] practice quietly, you know, just by

[46:53] myself, solo practice."

[46:55] And the Buddha cautions him saying that

[46:57] isolation is very difficult to endure

[47:00] for someone who's not yet mastered very

[47:01] deep states of immersion or mental

[47:03] concentration. And to illustrate this,

[47:05] he contrasts a great bull elephant with

[47:08] smaller animals. And he says, you know,

[47:10] suppose there's a large lake, along

[47:12] comes a bull elephant, he thinks, "Ah,

[47:13] why don't I just plunge into this lake

[47:15] and play around, wash my ears and back?"

[47:17] He does it and of course his giant

[47:20] incarnation finds a footing in the

[47:21] depths of the lake because, you know,

[47:23] it's huge, sheer size and strength.

[47:26] And compares it to the hare

[47:28] or the cat.

[47:30] And the Buddha explains that if a

[47:31] smaller creature, like a rabbit or a

[47:33] cat, looks at the elephant, rashly

[47:35] assumes it can do the same,

[47:37] it will quickly sink or float because it

[47:40] has no footing in the depths.

[47:42] >> Mhm.

[47:42] >> [clears throat]

[47:43] >> So, your reference is actually really

[47:45] fun and interesting, too, for all of us

[47:48] because

[47:49] what the Buddha was trying to say to

[47:51] this monk is

[47:53] find footing

[47:56] in life.

[47:57] To your point, find where your practice

[48:00] is

[48:01] instantiated in your real life.

[48:04] Then you can go

[48:06] to the mountains, to the cave.

[48:09] So, it's weirdly appropriate that you

[48:12] just said all of what you just said

[48:14] about your own practice that it really

[48:15] is life itself. It really is finding

[48:18] your presence in your

[48:20] practice in in daily existence as well

[48:23] as, you know, of course having a sitting

[48:25] practice cuz without that we're nowhere.

[48:28] >> Mhm, [clears throat] absolutely. That

[48:29] reminds me of another I think it's in

[48:31] fragrant palm leaves, but Thich Nhat

[48:34] Hanh talking about whenever the first

[48:36] Westerners started going to Vietnam to

[48:38] meditate, they were coming from the Zen

[48:40] tradition and

[48:41] you know, these Americans like

[48:44] and we what do we do? Meditate for 10

[48:46] hours a day? And he you know, Thich Nhat

[48:47] Hanh just started laughing. He's like,

[48:48] what for?

[48:50] Maybe meditate for for I do 45 minutes a

[48:52] day.

[48:53] >> All right.

[48:54] >> Yeah.

[48:55] >> And then goes out and fights for what's

[48:56] right.

[48:57] >> Exactly.

[48:58] >> [laughter]

[48:59] >> Yeah.

[49:00] Wow.

[49:01] Chapter two is called slow.

[49:04] And

[49:05] I'd love to hear what your sort of

[49:07] intent was with this and I think I

[49:10] picked out the one that I want to read.

[49:11] >> Mhm, yes. So, slow

[49:14] >> [sighs and gasps]

[49:15] >> is about recalibrating.

[49:18] It's about looking at how you were

[49:21] existing in life and now learning

[49:24] how to live more slowly and then what

[49:27] that's going to feel like

[49:29] and what that's going to do for you.

[49:31] >> Beautiful.

[49:33] Page 88.

[49:36] Until you understand your own patterns,

[49:38] perceptions, and pains,

[49:41] you'll keep mistaking them for someone

[49:43] else's.

[49:47] >> Yeah.

[49:47] >> It's like that emoji with the teeth,

[49:49] rectangular.

[49:51] >> [laughter]

[49:52] >> Oh.

[49:52] >> Yeah.

[49:53] >> It's so hard. I remember um

[49:55] to the earlier discussion that we had, I

[49:57] just remember so many moments of being

[49:59] so angry at the world. And now, moving

[50:03] more slowly and feeling my age and

[50:06] feeling the depth of my practice,

[50:09] it's much easier to see that literally

[50:11] everything I'm complaining about in

[50:13] myself has to do with me.

[50:15] >> Mhm.

[50:15] >> And the complaints can cease and I can

[50:19] sort myself out. I don't have to worry

[50:22] about sorting anyone else out or turning

[50:24] anyone else into the vision of that I

[50:26] have of them. It's not my business.

[50:28] >> Yes, that's such a powerful realization

[50:30] to have. I mean,

[50:32] it really is about how much can we

[50:35] reposition our own

[50:37] engagement with everything that

[50:39] surrounds us because the stuff that

[50:41] surrounds us just is, you know, it's the

[50:44] suchness. It's just there. It's just the

[50:46] stuff.

[50:47] And it has no preference.

[50:50] And now,

[50:51] >> and it will continue with or without us.

[50:53] >> [laughter]

[50:53] >> That's right.

[50:55] >> If we die, all of this will keep going.

[50:58] Discover is the third section and I'm

[51:02] going to read my bit before I give it to

[51:04] you, if you'll forgive me.

[51:06] A simple way to improve your life, page

[51:08] 114.

[51:10] Stop trying to be understood by people

[51:13] who don't understand themselves.

[51:17] Woo!

[51:22] There's a part of me that just wants to

[51:24] be loved, liked, admired, respected. And

[51:28] now, I'm seeing this new part through

[51:30] those 10 days. I can't wait to go back

[51:32] and do many more days. This new part is

[51:36] so much less concerned

[51:39] with anyone else's experience of me and

[51:42] much more concerned with my own deep

[51:45] integrity.

[51:47] >> That's

[51:49] >> Discover. It's just so important, I

[51:51] think, to um keep ourselves in the place

[51:54] of studentship. And for me, that's what

[51:56] this section is about.

[51:57] >> Mhm. [clears throat] Yeah, exactly. It's

[52:01] once you do slow down, you start to see

[52:02] the world and yourself differently.

[52:05] And whenever you get access to this new

[52:07] view of being,

[52:10] then you get the learning process all

[52:13] over again, but it's a joyful process.

[52:15] It's you know, even if it uh comes with

[52:18] discomfort sometimes, there's great joy

[52:20] in that because that discomfort is just

[52:23] simply growing pains, you know? Those

[52:25] are the things that like

[52:27] you've been feeling

[52:29] those brief moment of discomfort you

[52:31] might feel in a discovery phase, you

[52:34] felt the pain of that every day for your

[52:36] entire life.

[52:37] You're just realizing it now for the

[52:39] first time.

[52:41] And so, just sit there with it, and then

[52:43] that's how it will resolve itself, and

[52:45] you won't carry that with you anymore.

[52:47] >> And actually, it really does resolve

[52:50] itself

[52:51] >> Yeah.

[52:52] >> in the quiet of sitting. It would

[52:53] probably be a day when you were so

[52:55] uncomfortable, or several days. There's

[52:56] a big pain in your shoulder, your hip,

[52:58] your ass, your knee, whatever it is.

[53:00] That's what's happening. I have two more

[53:03] pages to read in the discover section

[53:04] because I think it's important, and we

[53:06] have the time. 140 to 141. They can't be

[53:09] taken separately.

[53:11] They have to be together. Page 140.

[53:14] The ego forces itself into every

[53:16] experience,

[53:17] which is why even small frictions cause

[53:20] reactions.

[53:22] Watching for this habit shows you that

[53:24] not only is most tension meaningless,

[53:29] but it likely has nothing to do with you

[53:31] in the first place.

[53:34] And then, sort of a coda, page 141. Just

[53:38] in case you didn't really get that.

[53:40] >> [laughter]

[53:42] >> Life is just happening.

[53:44] Happening is in italics. Life is just

[53:47] happening.

[53:48] It's not happening to you.

[53:51] Remember this

[53:52] when drama, conflict, or noise creates

[53:55] tension inside you.

[53:57] Or seems to, that's my note.

[53:59] The mind quickly builds a story about

[54:02] me,

[54:03] my problem, and this story fuels your

[54:07] emotions.

[54:08] But life is unfolding on its own.

[54:11] Most things that are happening that seem

[54:12] very close to you are not personal. Just

[54:15] events moving through time, here in one

[54:19] moment and gone the next.

[54:22] Let go of the story.

[54:24] Let go of the mental drama.

[54:26] Return your attention to the calm life

[54:29] flowing in front of you

[54:31] right now.

[54:34] Most things aren't personal.

[54:37] This is one of the biggest

[54:38] understandings and discoveries, if I

[54:40] may, that I made in this 10-day

[54:44] I feel like such a an amateur, only 10

[54:46] days, but

[54:47] I've made this discovery about myself. I

[54:50] was making everything about me. I was

[54:53] slowly learning over time being the

[54:55] parent of a teenager that it really

[54:56] wasn't about me, and I I got some good

[54:58] insight just in my parenting and

[55:00] practice prior to this.

[55:02] But during that 10 days when it was just

[55:05] all all all practice,

[55:07] I noticed the tension that I brought

[55:09] inside of myself willingly and choosing

[55:12] it.

[55:14] And then I started to not do that, and I

[55:16] started to watch, to your point here

[55:18] about everything changing here in one

[55:20] moment, gone the next. I just watched it

[55:22] constantly changing. Changing again, and

[55:26] then changing again. It changed my body,

[55:28] that pain moved to there, that pain

[55:30] softened, that pain heightened.

[55:32] And then it changed to my mind.

[55:35] And to learn that it really is just the

[55:36] physics of mind meeting matter and

[55:38] matter meeting mind

[55:40] became a such a revelation for me. And

[55:43] then having this book waiting for me

[55:46] when I got home, it was like the

[55:47] blessing on the blessing.

[55:49] And I was able to really put it all

[55:51] together in a way that made just worlds

[55:53] of sense.

[55:55] >> Beautiful.

[55:55] >> Thank you.

[55:56] >> Oh, that's beautiful. [clears throat] I

[55:57] love it. And I like that you mentioned,

[55:59] you know, that you felt like an amateur

[56:00] and I know you're just kind of joking,

[56:02] but that feeling, that's the one that we

[56:04] should all be looking for.

[56:07] That means that we're, you know, in new

[56:09] territory internally that we haven't

[56:11] rehearsed and parsed out and, you know,

[56:16] and made work for us you know, all the

[56:18] time. That's where the good stuff is.

[56:21] >> Gosh, become is the next section and the

[56:24] page that I pulled for this one is page

[56:27] 160. Underrated life skill.

[56:30] Knowing when to let your silence say

[56:32] everything.

[56:34] And I'm going to share something really

[56:35] deep and also really personal and

[56:37] probably TMI, but whatever.

[56:41] Sometimes in romantic situations with my

[56:44] partner, let's say,

[56:47] that silence becomes super, super sexy.

[56:50] Number one.

[56:51] >> Mhm.

[56:52] >> [clears throat]

[56:53] >> Number two, silence when it comes to my

[56:56] kid who's now starting to figure out

[56:59] where he wants to be in the world, what

[57:00] his job is going to be, does he want to

[57:02] go back to school, does he want to just

[57:04] work, who does he want to work for, does

[57:06] he want to settle and compromise,

[57:08] my silence in that situation totally

[57:11] different from the romantic one with my

[57:13] partner, says everything.

[57:16] I trust you is what that silence says. I

[57:19] trust you to make a good choice.

[57:21] Here are my experiences,

[57:23] but that's all I'm going to say.

[57:25] And I wonder where all of this lands for

[57:28] you, Corey, and what the become section

[57:30] for you really was and is.

[57:33] >> Mhm, I love those examples. That's such

[57:34] a great way to showcase the idea in

[57:37] there. Yeah, the become section is

[57:40] really about now that you have

[57:43] stepped out of the urgency and

[57:45] reactivity of modern life,

[57:48] you've explored and slowed down,

[57:50] discovered some things about yourself

[57:52] and what it means to live in a bit of a

[57:54] different way and to relate to yourself

[57:56] differently.

[57:58] The become is now let's turn that into

[58:02] who we are. Let's start living these

[58:04] ideas and see how they,

[58:07] you know, can exist in the world with

[58:09] us.

[58:10] And to the example that you shared for

[58:14] that reading is that yeah, the silence

[58:17] that is a very strong, a very powerful

[58:21] form of communication and some of the

[58:23] transmission there is like

[58:26] you don't have to

[58:28] over explain everything, you don't have

[58:30] to tap dance for the world.

[58:34] Sometimes you can communicate much

[58:37] cleaner and much more cleanly

[58:39] just through simplicity and sometimes

[58:41] through nothing at all because life

[58:42] isn't about words at the end of the day.

[58:46] Life is about feeling, it's about

[58:49] presence, it's about how you say things,

[58:52] not what you say. It's about the

[58:54] presence of your being in your life and

[58:58] how you're embodying that.

[59:00] Not just whatever quotes you've

[59:02] memorized.

[59:04] And so, yes, it's pointing to that

[59:07] deeper thing and you just extracted it

[59:09] beautifully.

[59:10] Which was in a romantic situation,

[59:13] silence could mean we're communicating

[59:17] on a level that makes language look

[59:19] laughable.

[59:20] And

[59:21] >> [clears throat]

[59:21] >> there's nothing to be said, no sounds to

[59:24] be made here because there's a

[59:26] connection and a communication that's

[59:27] just like it's way deeper than that.

[59:30] Say in relationship to your son, yeah,

[59:33] it's the silence is trust cuz it's like

[59:35] you don't need Mommy to tell you what to

[59:37] do. You know, and Mommy isn't going to

[59:39] insult you by telling you what to do.

[59:41] And she trusts you. And then this can

[59:44] also go to the less pleasant side of

[59:46] life.

[59:48] Which is somebody you know in your life

[59:49] is dramatic and is always, you know,

[59:52] talking or something like that.

[59:54] Silence can say, "I'm not interested in

[59:57] that."

[59:58] >> Yeah, I'm not taking part in that.

[59:59] >> Yeah, I'm not taking part in that.

[1:00:01] And and so on.

[1:00:03] >> Gosh, I could go on for days about this,

[1:00:05] but I have two pages in the arise

[1:00:06] section that I think really

[1:00:09] the final section of the book that

[1:00:10] really bring everything home.

[1:00:13] I'm on page 238 and 239.

[1:00:17] 238, "The world is loud and always

[1:00:20] seeking your attention. It will try to

[1:00:22] pull you into its urgency, outrage, and

[1:00:25] endless distractions."

[1:00:28] "Clarity and inner peace protect you

[1:00:31] from being drawn into life's drama.

[1:00:34] They help you see the noise without

[1:00:35] becoming the noise.

[1:00:37] Step back without disconnecting

[1:00:40] and continue living with your mental

[1:00:43] freedom."

[1:00:45] One of the reasons why I love this book

[1:00:47] is because yes to all of that. We've

[1:00:49] talked about this multiple times in many

[1:00:51] ways, but the facing page 239

[1:00:54] [clears throat]

[1:00:55] >> is the how.

[1:00:56] >> Here's the how. Ready?

[1:00:57] >> Mhm.

[1:00:58] >> "Your environment shapes your mind more

[1:01:00] than you might think.

[1:01:02] This is the instruction manual, dear

[1:01:04] listener.

[1:01:05] Design your space so distractions are

[1:01:08] out of sight and supportive tools are

[1:01:11] easy to access. Put meaningful books

[1:01:13] where you'll see them.

[1:01:15] Keep your phone out of reach.

[1:01:18] Make your meditation cushion visible.

[1:01:20] Always have a glass of water nearby.

[1:01:23] When your living space is set up well,

[1:01:26] good habits become easier to follow.

[1:01:28] You create less resistance to growth

[1:01:31] and stay aligned with the life you want

[1:01:33] to live.

[1:01:35] >> So beautiful.

[1:01:36] >> Thank you. Now, I love that you picked

[1:01:37] that one out. It also there's two things

[1:01:38] is that one

[1:01:40] you've noticed there the intentionality

[1:01:44] behind

[1:01:45] which page follows the next. Everything

[1:01:48] there is very intentional. So, look cuz

[1:01:50] this is the first short-form book I did

[1:01:52] instead of a long-form book,

[1:01:55] I know each page has its own

[1:01:57] self-contained idea, but those ideas

[1:01:59] need to talk to each other and need to

[1:02:01] flow and go somewhere.

[1:02:03] And so, if each section has about 50

[1:02:06] entries in it,

[1:02:07] I would write them all down

[1:02:09] and then I would go back and organize

[1:02:12] them. So, I have this this really cool

[1:02:13] app called Milanote, which you can

[1:02:15] basically have infinite amount of like

[1:02:18] what would basically be like digital

[1:02:19] post-it notes on your screen.

[1:02:21] And so, I'd write all these things and

[1:02:23] then go in and then sequence them and

[1:02:25] organize them to where

[1:02:27] each one opens an idea,

[1:02:30] but then the next one will pick up where

[1:02:32] that idea left off, but then open

[1:02:34] another idea and so on and so on and so

[1:02:37] on until the whole thing is just slowly

[1:02:38] morphing.

[1:02:40] So, it is showing you this way and this

[1:02:43] path

[1:02:44] even though

[1:02:46] each page is self-contained. So, I love

[1:02:48] that you noticed that. And

[1:02:49] the one that you just read almost didn't

[1:02:51] make the cut because I wondered if

[1:02:55] it would feel too out of context for

[1:02:58] some of the other stuff.

[1:02:59] >> [snorts]

[1:02:59] >> And then I thought, "No, that's the

[1:03:01] reason why it needs to stay."

[1:03:03] is because

[1:03:03] >> That's a recipe.

[1:03:04] >> Yeah, exactly.

[1:03:06] >> [laughter]

[1:03:06] >> Exactly.

[1:03:07] >> it.

[1:03:09] Um the first page, the clarity as

[1:03:11] protection, it reminds me of, you know,

[1:03:13] our love, Diego, [snorts]

[1:03:16] who got out the materials and the tools

[1:03:19] to blaze through the brush and pave this

[1:03:22] path.

[1:03:23] >> Mhm.

[1:03:24] >> Clarity is protection.

[1:03:26] >> Mhm. [clears throat]

[1:03:28] >> I don't know that would have made as

[1:03:30] much sense to me in your book

[1:03:33] without previously being so

[1:03:36] steeped in his work. Diego Perez, also

[1:03:38] known as Young Pueblo, previously

[1:03:40] mentioned here. Kind of a glue that

[1:03:43] brings you and me together

[1:03:45] and brings all of this great work

[1:03:50] to more and more humans, opening their

[1:03:54] minds and hearts up to the work that we

[1:03:56] do. And vice versa, of course. This

[1:03:59] echoes of him and his heart. And I just

[1:04:02] wanted to mention him and just say thank

[1:04:04] you. I think he is the one who

[1:04:05] introduced us and

[1:04:07] made me aware of you. And I'm just

[1:04:09] forever grateful

[1:04:11] for that.

[1:04:11] >> Oh, yeah. He's the man. Trying

[1:04:13] >> He's the man.

[1:04:14] >> [laughter]

[1:04:15] >> Uh, it's trying to feel

[1:04:18] to people expect

[1:04:21] people who they see that are public

[1:04:22] figures to be one way in public and

[1:04:25] another way in private, which is true to

[1:04:28] a degree. But, I like to tell people

[1:04:31] that Diego is better in private than he

[1:04:34] is in public.

[1:04:35] >> Oh my god.

[1:04:36] It's so true.

[1:04:38] It's so true. On the last night we got

[1:04:40] to sit with him and Sarah and have a

[1:04:43] moment with them. My best friend and I

[1:04:44] were both at the 10-day.

[1:04:46] And it was such a good um reminder of

[1:04:49] who he is. Not just the teacher in the

[1:04:51] front of the room, and not just the

[1:04:53] friend of mine, you know, that I've

[1:04:55] known for however many 15 years. There's

[1:04:58] somebody in there that really means it.

[1:05:01] This is really his life. This is really

[1:05:03] his path. He is really here to show us

[1:05:06] that all of us don't need to give up on

[1:05:09] this path just because we think we've

[1:05:11] been a certain way or we've made a

[1:05:12] certain mistake or a certain bunch of

[1:05:14] mistakes. No, we stay on the path. He's

[1:05:17] doing it. He stayed on the path. He's

[1:05:20] creating the space for himself to shine

[1:05:23] quietly,

[1:05:25] to be an example, and all of us are

[1:05:28] learning from that.

[1:05:29] >> Oh, yeah. And one of the things that

[1:05:30] people don't talk about with him or I

[1:05:33] don't see anyone giving him credit for,

[1:05:35] but I'm going to do it now,

[1:05:37] is that in his journey,

[1:05:39] like most of people we know are wealthy

[1:05:42] and notable public figures, right? Just

[1:05:45] we know so many of those people because

[1:05:46] of our industry that we're in.

[1:05:49] I have seen people go from not being

[1:05:52] that to being that and seen how they've

[1:05:54] changed through that process, which is

[1:05:56] an inescapable part of it. You do

[1:05:58] change. You have to change.

[1:06:01] The way that Diego

[1:06:03] has managed to

[1:06:05] in the increase of his profile, like

[1:06:08] profound increase of his profile,

[1:06:10] increase of his wealth, the increase of

[1:06:12] his connections in the industry, just

[1:06:14] globally with people who are, you know,

[1:06:17] entrepreneurs, people in the

[1:06:18] entertainment business, people in

[1:06:20] uh all sorts of sectors,

[1:06:23] the way that he has managed that and how

[1:06:26] he's let it inform his work, he's let it

[1:06:29] fuel the possibilities of his ideas,

[1:06:34] not change how he relates to other

[1:06:36] people or himself,

[1:06:38] cuz I've seen some bad versions of that.

[1:06:41] I was thinking of one this morning, as a

[1:06:43] matter of fact. [laughter]

[1:06:44] Um and I've been a party I've been, you

[1:06:47] know,

[1:06:48] close to some that have gone in

[1:06:51] unfavorable directions, but the way that

[1:06:53] he has managed that, I just think needs

[1:06:55] some love

[1:06:57] and respect because that's work that you

[1:06:58] don't get receipts for. People don't see

[1:07:01] that. There's not posts about that, but

[1:07:02] he's still doing that and uh it

[1:07:06] succeeding as well as he is is inner

[1:07:08] work.

[1:07:09] >> And behind every great man is a really

[1:07:12] [clears throat] incredible partner,

[1:07:13] woman in this case, Sarah. I'm going to

[1:07:16] give you some love and say if you ever

[1:07:18] listen to this, thank you so much for

[1:07:19] being a force of practice, femininity,

[1:07:23] and clarity. Because without you,

[1:07:26] the possibilities that Diego has to to

[1:07:29] show up in this way, to navigate this

[1:07:31] transition in this way,

[1:07:33] would not be possible.

[1:07:35] >> Absolutely.

[1:07:36] Absolutely. And I think having someone

[1:07:38] That's what one of the things him and I

[1:07:39] talk about that we've both been in, you

[1:07:41] know, really long-term relationships.

[1:07:44] And that that has a specific

[1:07:48] wisdom. Yes, signature and wisdom to

[1:07:50] where it doesn't let you play this

[1:07:54] character that you've became.

[1:07:57] >> You can try to be two different people,

[1:07:59] but you can't do it for long.

[1:08:00] >> Exactly. Exactly.

[1:08:02] >> going to work. Mhm. Oh, brother, thank

[1:08:04] you so much for all of this generous

[1:08:06] time and care and fun and depth and

[1:08:10] meaning. It's just everything. Thank you

[1:08:13] for this.

[1:08:13] >> Oh, it's been my pleasure. Yeah, thank

[1:08:15] you so much for creating the space and

[1:08:17] inviting me back and just bringing the

[1:08:20] your insight and your attention and your

[1:08:22] care to people and and also to the book

[1:08:26] and the writing and just the generosity.

[1:08:29] I really appreciate it. And also, I love

[1:08:31] that

[1:08:32] we did the longest podcast ever. That's

[1:08:34] become

[1:08:35] >> Ever.

[1:08:35] >> That's become an interesting trait

[1:08:39] [laughter]

[1:08:39] with the podcast I've done. I'm I'm

[1:08:42] about to really kick into high gear, but

[1:08:43] I've done a couple so far.

[1:08:46] And they've all broken the structure

[1:08:49] somehow. And I just love that because

[1:08:52] it's really

[1:08:54] it's the point of the book. And I love

[1:08:55] it's kind of shepherding this thing.

[1:08:57] Like the one you feed with Eric Zimmer.

[1:09:01] And you know, he always starts with the

[1:09:02] parable with the the two wolf parable.

[1:09:05] And he started that and he joked about

[1:09:07] like one day I'm going to drop it, but

[1:09:08] let's do it. And I go, hold on, hold on.

[1:09:10] You don't have to do it.

[1:09:12] >> [gasps]

[1:09:12] >> And he didn't do it.

[1:09:14] >> I don't know, let me think about it. I

[1:09:15] was like, man, this book is about

[1:09:19] recognizing

[1:09:20] where you're at, what pattern you've

[1:09:23] been in, noticing [clears throat]

[1:09:24] what isn't serving you, stepping out of

[1:09:27] that, and then choosing a different type

[1:09:30] of autonomy and personal sovereignty. If

[1:09:33] you don't want to do it, don't do the

[1:09:35] thing. And he goes, okay, you know what?

[1:09:36] We're not doing it.

[1:09:38] it. [laughter]

[1:09:39] It's off. Off the table. Oh, I love that

[1:09:42] guy so much. What an example too of

[1:09:45] clarity and sobriety and kindness.

[1:09:48] >> Yeah, and values, yeah.

[1:09:51] >> And values, yes.

[1:09:52] >> He's keeping it real in a landscape of

[1:09:54] podcast world that is

[1:09:56] >> [laughter]

[1:09:56] >> of unreality.

[1:09:58] >> Totally. Uh dear listeners, the last

[1:10:01] four pages of The Quiet Age, I'm going

[1:10:03] to leave them for you. They're a little

[1:10:05] present from Cory

[1:10:07] to you. Don't forget about them, the

[1:10:09] last four pages. And the book is called

[1:10:12] The Quiet Age.

[1:10:14] Cory Allen, c o r y a l l e n if you're

[1:10:18] going to go look him up right now, dear

[1:10:19] listener, you're my hero. Thank you for

[1:10:22] being.

[1:10:22] >> Thank you for being and thank you for

[1:10:24] having me.

[1:10:25] >> Oh, and thank your wife, too. She must

[1:10:26] be doing something things [laughter]

[1:10:27] right.

[1:10:28] >> I will. She is. Let me just say she's a

[1:10:31] soldier. Let's put it that way.

[1:10:33] >> I bet. I bet. [clears throat]

[1:10:35] So, thank you, woman. Thank you.

[1:10:38] Okay. More soon, dear friend.

[1:10:45] >> [music]

[1:10:50] [music]

[1:11:01] >> Hey.

Elena Brower
ArtistElena Brower

Elena Brower is a yoga and meditation teacher, author, and podcast host known for integrating mindfulness practice with creative attention and spiritual intelligence. She has taugh…

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Got Questions?

Frequently Asked Questions

The Quiet Age, subtitled creating a calm life in a chaotic world, is a book of short insights presented on alternating white and black pages. Allen argues that people need to actively reclaim their attention and time from systems designed to keep them engaged. Elena Brower described it on her Practice You podcast as a book whose pages can be read one at a time.
Brower read Allen's page 12 on her podcast, which says that stepping back from urgency culture is not about ignoring your responsibilities. It is about taking back part of your life so you can prioritize your happiness and feel less overwhelmed. The idea is a reallocation of time and attention rather than withdrawal from the world.
Cory Allen uses the phrase to describe the state he sees many people falling into as their attention, energy and sense of self are pulled into algorithmic platforms. He said he felt existentially fatigued by this pattern and believed it was shaping how people live. The term frames the problem as systemic rather than a personal failing.
Cory Allen, who co-owns the company Pulse, says it created the first mindfulness smart ring. The ring vibrates gently in several modes to nudge the wearer back into the present moment and out of autopilot. Elena Brower said hers prompts her to go outside, especially during the golden hour.
Allen argues that technology has been collapsing in on itself across the industrial, electronic and digital ages. He sees the present as the first moment when people must play an active role rather than be swept along. His stated decision is not to be carried by the tide of compressed life.
Brower's example suggests beginning with one insight at a time and letting it show you where your commitments are too dense. She reduced her calendar to two or three items a day and began taking meals seated and quietly. Allen emphasizes that a reset takes time and is not a single dramatic decision.
Not entirely. Allen frames the goal as taking an active role in how technology shapes your life, not vanishing from the world or ignoring responsibilities. The book's emphasis is on choosing what you connect to and when, which is a more selective relationship with devices.

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