Transcript
[0:00] Okay, great. So, um, warm welcome from
[0:03] me. My name is Kusala Lasara and, um,
[0:06] this is this is Dharma. Uh, Dharma being
[0:09] a word with many meanings, but in this
[0:12] case means that what what the Buddha
[0:13] taught or what Buddhism has to say. So,
[0:16] uh, in this on Dharmite, um, we uh, we
[0:20] meditate, but we also explore Buddhist
[0:23] ideas and [clears throat] themes. Um, so
[0:25] that's what we're going to do tonight.
[0:27] and we're looking we've got a series um
[0:30] that we're well into where we're
[0:32] learning about the disciples of the
[0:35] Buddha. So people who are contemporary
[0:37] to the Buddha um uh who met him uh and
[0:43] uh um followed his teaching and we're
[0:47] really lucky actually because um uh
[0:50] Buddhist Buddhism has got a lot of
[0:52] documentation
[0:54] uh drawn from those early times. Um it
[0:57] wasn't written down for many years but
[0:59] uh but uh the oral tradition passed on
[1:02] um uh sways of information about the
[1:05] Buddha and uh the people around him. And
[1:08] so the there's a huge amount of
[1:10] information. There's so many characters
[1:12] uh who the Buddha meets, so many people
[1:14] he taught. We have their names. We have
[1:16] their backgrounds. Um so there's a
[1:18] wealth of information to to choose from.
[1:21] Okay, great. So yeah, I promised I'd
[1:23] introduce you to V Saka um who the
[1:27] Buddha said was foremost of his female
[1:30] disciples in generosity and the Buddha
[1:33] had this habit of proclaiming the
[1:35] qualities of his disciples. So um yeah
[1:38] others others were foremost in
[1:41] supernatural powers or um articulating
[1:45] the dharma. Uh um yeah. So she was for
[1:48] most of his female disciples in in
[1:50] generosity and we'll we'll definitely
[1:54] explore that. I'm going to give you some
[1:57] details of her life to start with. So um
[2:00] she's there's quite a lot written about
[2:01] her life and so I'm I'm not going to be
[2:05] able to tell you everything. Um but you
[2:08] can look look her up uh if you want to
[2:11] find out more. But uh yeah, here goes.
[2:14] hears something at least. Um, so what
[2:17] she came from a wellto-do family and the
[2:20] the wellto-do family, they were
[2:22] interested in what the Buddha had to say
[2:24] and so she heard him teach age seven and
[2:29] had a strong uh a strong response, a
[2:32] strong devotional response and from then
[2:34] on she really felt like she was a
[2:36] Buddhist. Um uh so not only was she
[2:40] wealthy um uh but she was beautiful uh
[2:44] so she had everything going for her. Um
[2:47] yeah and she was yeah brought up in this
[2:48] Buddhist family. Her parents actually
[2:50] they gave food to the Buddha and his
[2:52] followers whenever they passed through
[2:54] their part of the world. Um so this was
[2:57] a bit later on uh in the Buddha's life.
[3:00] And um at age 16
[3:03] um she was spotted by some scouts uh the
[3:07] scouts of another uh wellto-do family,
[3:10] the son of a well wellto-do family. They
[3:12] were trying to get their son married um
[3:14] and he wasn't that keen to get married.
[3:17] So he gave a long list of attributes um
[3:19] of qualities of this ideal woman that he
[3:22] thought no that no such woman ever ex
[3:24] will ever exist. So I'll be I won't um
[3:28] I'll stay single. Um, but she was
[3:30] spotted and and the way she was spotted
[3:33] was that she uh she was with a group of
[3:36] friends and servants uh and it started
[3:39] raining. So she was walking along. I
[3:40] think they'd been down to the river or
[3:41] going to the river to bathe. It started
[3:43] raining and everybody else um got in a
[3:46] panic and just dashed dashed off and she
[3:48] didn't change her pace whatsoever. So
[3:51] she stayed um walking at exactly the
[3:53] same pace retained her dignity. Um and
[3:58] um the the only thing and the these
[4:02] wife scouts, let's call them, um uh
[4:06] spotted this and saw her uh her sort of
[4:10] natural grace and were impressed by her
[4:12] department, but although she was soaking
[4:14] wet. So they asked her, "How come you
[4:16] didn't dash off like the others?" And
[4:19] she said, "Well, you know, it wouldn't
[4:21] be becoming for a king if it started
[4:23] raining to dash off uh or a great um
[4:27] royal elephant who had loads of um
[4:30] adornments and cloths and gold
[4:33] trimmings. If it started raining, the
[4:35] elephant would just uh stay at the same
[4:38] pace and maintain its dignity." And she
[4:41] said, "And that's what I do." Um and the
[4:45] these uh people were very impressed with
[4:48] um her attitude as well. So um and they
[4:50] also learned during that conversation
[4:52] that she had lovely teeth where they
[4:53] hadn't been able to spot that yet. Uh
[4:56] that was the final um requirement. So So
[5:02] um so this the family um of this young
[5:06] man uh sort of a neighboring uh wealthy
[5:09] area. This young man's name was uh Puna
[5:12] Vardina. Um uh uh this the scouts went
[5:17] and explained the to the family uh this
[5:20] great woman they'd met. And it was
[5:22] agreed between everyone that she would
[5:23] marry. Um and so she was she was um
[5:29] there were lots and lots of preparations
[5:31] for this marriage because it was a great
[5:33] sort of stately affair like two wealthy
[5:36] families coming together. Um and very
[5:40] there's lots of detail about her dowy
[5:42] which um I don't find yeah I don't find
[5:45] particularly interesting except for um
[5:48] well there was one piece of expensive
[5:50] jewelry that was made and especially for
[5:53] this occasion and it it took that she
[5:56] couldn't move she couldn't leave and um
[5:58] go to the to get married until this
[6:01] jewelry had been finished um in its
[6:04] creation and it cost um a lot of money
[6:08] and it took a lot of time. So, uh, three
[6:11] months it still wasn't made and there
[6:13] were inquiries as to why it wasn't
[6:15] finished and they'd run out of fuel to
[6:17] um melt the gold. Uh, and so then the
[6:20] local people had to like everybody
[6:24] everyone she was very popular. So, yeah,
[6:26] I need to say that as well. Like people
[6:28] loved her. So, people contributed to the
[6:30] fuel to melt the gold. Um, and that took
[6:33] that took a little while longer.
[6:35] [clears throat]
[6:36] And this um amazing piece of jewelry uh
[6:39] was created. Um and just to say
[6:42] something about this jewelry, it was
[6:45] made like a peacock. Um and when she put
[6:48] it on her head, apparently um it it was
[6:52] huge. And um when she put it on her
[6:55] head, she could she looked like a
[6:56] peacock standing on a mountain. And it
[6:59] was only when people got close that they
[7:01] couldn't tell that it wasn't a real
[7:02] golden peacock standing on a mountain.
[7:05] So I yeah I don't I don't know what I
[7:09] actually don't know what that means
[7:10] there [laughter]
[7:12] um never seen or can't really imagine it
[7:15] but there we go it was and it has a role
[7:17] to play in the later pieces the story
[7:20] apparently when she moved it made
[7:22] beautiful sounds that the the like the
[7:25] the golden the gold rot peacock feathers
[7:28] kind of jangled and played music as well
[7:30] so quite quite the piece of jewelry.
[7:34] Yeah. So she got married and she went to
[7:36] live in this other family and they had
[7:38] quite complicated family dynamics when
[7:40] she arrived because they um they weren't
[7:43] Buddhists. So there around that time in
[7:46] India there were lots of
[7:49] uh there was lots of spiritual
[7:50] exploration [clears throat]
[7:52] um and lots of people trying out
[7:54] different things. You learn about this
[7:55] in the Buddha's life story as well. He
[7:57] he um before he became the Buddha, he
[8:00] was trying out loads of different
[8:01] things. Um and uh you often he often you
[8:05] often hear stories of him encountering
[8:08] um aesthetics from this sect or that
[8:10] sect. And anyway there um the family
[8:13] dynamic was because the the family she
[8:16] married into they they um
[8:20] were they paid allegiance to the James
[8:23] um who were naked aesthetics and um
[8:28] uh they uh there were v various
[8:30] incidents. So she be she remained a
[8:33] devout Buddhist and there are various
[8:35] sort of religious differences within the
[8:37] family. Um one time remember she's a
[8:40] very fine lady and one time she went
[8:44] into a room and all the the
[8:46] father-in-law had gathered all the naked
[8:48] Jane aesthetics into a room and she was
[8:50] pretty shocked to see a whole room full
[8:52] of um nude men and she she um um was a
[8:58] bit upset about that. So that was one
[8:59] argument they they had. Um uh and
[9:04] sometimes when she um invited Buddhist
[9:08] wanderers in um the father-in-law would
[9:11] um be rude to them. Uh he didn't like
[9:13] her inviting them to to stay
[9:17] or to uh have meals.
[9:20] [clears throat]
[9:23] So this was definitely a s a source of
[9:25] tension.
[9:28] hand after one
[9:31] incident
[9:32] um when her father-in-law was
[9:34] particularly rude to her Buddhist um
[9:38] guests, she decided to leave and um uh
[9:43] her father-in-law was called Migara and
[9:46] he persuaded her to say to stay um and
[9:50] she eventually and and was sorry that
[9:53] he'd been so rude and cause so much
[9:55] offense. So obviously they're not too
[9:57] bad a her family, but
[9:59] she said she would stay and not not run
[10:01] away from her husband, but she set the
[10:04] condition that she could invite the
[10:05] Buddha if he came past uh and his um his
[10:10] retinue. So other homeless wanderers um
[10:13] who were followers of the Buddha.
[10:16] So this happened. Um so one day the
[10:19] Buddha came into town uh and she invited
[10:23] the Buddha around and some of his monks
[10:26] and um her father-in-law he said hi to
[10:30] the Buddha but then he he dashed off as
[10:32] quickly as he could and um he hid behind
[10:36] a curtain. So the Buddha was given a
[10:38] meal and then he um talked about the
[10:41] dharma. So he he taught the dharma. Uh,
[10:44] the father-in-law, Nigara, was behind
[10:46] the curtain.
[10:48] I I think he wasn't I don't know why he
[10:50] was hiding behind the curtain. He did he
[10:52] definitely didn't want to be associated
[10:54] with the Buddha, but he obviously his
[10:56] curiosity was aroused. Um, so he
[10:58] obviously wanted to hear what the Buddha
[11:00] had to say. So from behind the curtain,
[11:03] um, he could not help but be affected by
[11:05] whatever the Buddha was teaching. And he
[11:08] um like um his daughter-in-law when she
[11:12] was seven he had a very very strong
[11:14] devotional response and he had well his
[11:17] mind was conver converted to Buddhism by
[11:20] the Buddha's teaching and um yeah he had
[11:24] this strong conversion experience
[11:27] uh he must have popped out from behind
[11:29] the curtain [laughter]
[11:31] you can imagine that bit um and he was
[11:33] very very uh grateful to Visaka after
[11:38] that and she um and he actually
[11:40] prostrated to her feet. So this is a
[11:43] like a completely a complete subversion
[11:46] of um you know a Indian in those days
[11:51] um family hierarchy for the son in for
[11:54] the father-in-law to prostrate at a
[11:56] daughter-in-law's feet and that they
[11:58] gave the joking name. He said you're
[12:00] like my mother to me I I um you've
[12:02] changed my life. You're like my mother
[12:04] to me. Um and so her her name became um
[12:09] Migara Mata the mother of Migar even
[12:12] though she was his daughter-in-law.
[12:16] Yeah.
[12:18] So that so that happened.
[12:20] [clears throat]
[12:21] Um and it seems like um actually with
[12:25] all her wealth, so she had a huge dowy
[12:28] uh she had property um uh it seems like
[12:32] she had quite a lot of um independence
[12:34] and was able to do she was involved in
[12:37] philanthropic projects in the town. um
[12:40] was able to um really um have a lot of
[12:44] influence and um freedom in what she did
[12:48] with her money. Um so this is um yeah
[12:51] this is this is the starting point
[12:55] really um of her her generosity to the
[13:00] the SA the followers of the Buddha. She
[13:04] um
[13:06] Yeah. Oh, [snorts]
[13:11] I will say now
[13:16] yes. So, in in a minute I'll tell you
[13:18] about a a big um a big moment in her
[13:22] life. Um but I'll just say something
[13:24] that she never became
[13:26] um a monastic or even homeless. So I was
[13:30] saying in the first half that the the
[13:32] two kinds of lay and um monastic or
[13:37] monastic is too strong a word for what
[13:39] their bu what the um setup was in in
[13:44] those days and really um it was just
[13:46] people who gave gave up everything but
[13:48] she didn't so she's become renown um as
[13:52] a Buddhist practitioner who maintained
[13:55] her responsibilities who who maintained
[13:57] her conventional life but was able to
[14:01] within that um make [clears throat]
[14:03] great spiritual progress and have a very
[14:06] positive influence on on the people
[14:09] around her. So personally she had a um a
[14:11] lot of strong experiences and she um had
[14:16] um she had a calming effect on those
[14:18] around her and as I said people really
[14:20] looked up to her. Um it seems to me like
[14:24] um she had great sort of gravitas
[14:26] actually. Um, and maybe that's because
[14:30] she had the Buddha teaching at a young
[14:32] age. Maybe maybe that influenced her um
[14:36] and gave her a sort of uh personal
[14:38] strength. I don't know. But um yes, so
[14:42] she never shaved her head. Um she never
[14:45] left her family. Um in fact, it said
[14:49] that she had 10 sons and 10 daughters.
[14:52] And they each had 10 sons and 10
[14:54] daughters. And also each of the
[14:58] each of them did as well. Um, and I
[15:00] actually did the maths earlier today and
[15:01] that's like over 8,000. Um, anyway,
[15:06] [laughter] so she was a family woman.
[15:08] Um, uh, yeah. So D
[15:12] um and it it's just interesting to think
[15:16] well I think it it's just something
[15:18] worth contemplating
[15:20] um about this this difference in
[15:22] lifestyle that
[15:26] well that there's this very very strong
[15:30] external um decision that we can make to
[15:34] leave everything you know join nowadays
[15:37] you could join a mon monastery in the UK
[15:39] I I don't know if anyone does um
[15:41] homeless wandering uh as a Buddhist
[15:43] practice. Maybe. I don't know. Um but
[15:47] but you could renounce everything and
[15:50] look distinctively like a Buddhist.
[15:53] Yeah. So you you'd have um rag robes um
[15:56] dyed in this saffron color. You'd you'd
[15:58] look like a Buddhist. Um and in that
[16:02] you're you're renouncing all status. Um
[16:06] you're renouncing your family. It's a
[16:08] very it's a very strong thing to do. Um
[16:11] and there were many wonderful monks and
[16:14] nuns. Um actually the term well there
[16:17] there were lots of different terms for
[16:18] them because they were still sort of
[16:19] working out what it what it meant. So it
[16:22] would be a biku would be a monk and that
[16:24] literally means arms gatherer or a
[16:26] bikuni
[16:28] as a female arms gatherer. So so both of
[16:31] those existed. Um and there were also
[16:36] and upacas so female and male lay
[16:40] practitioners who took refuge to the
[16:42] Buddha and maintained the the
[16:45] um
[16:47] the household of life really. Um and
[16:51] what's lovely is seeing that they both
[16:54] of them uh both both of those types of
[16:57] people could uh men and women lay and um
[17:02] monastic could make st strong spiritual
[17:05] progress and um yeah just to say
[17:08] something that um in in our Buddhist
[17:11] movement we've dispensed with that
[17:13] distinction. Um I think um some
[17:16] something to reflect on is
[17:19] uh
[17:21] how do I put it? Um
[17:25] well all of us need conditions in our
[17:27] lives to practice. Um we can't do it we
[17:30] can't we certainly can't do it alone.
[17:32] That's why we have the London Buddhist
[17:34] Center. That's why we have it in London
[17:36] and not on a on London Buddhist Center
[17:39] isn't on a remote mountain peak. Um we
[17:43] we need a community and we need other
[17:46] people around us to remind us of our
[17:48] values uh to uh to deepen our
[17:53] our commitment to deepen our
[17:55] communication to become more um open uh
[17:59] all of these things are part part of the
[18:01] the spiritual path and um why am I
[18:06] saying this? I am um
[18:09] and then there's different ways of
[18:11] organizing that and traditionally
[18:17] well early Buddhism didn't have such
[18:20] strong distinctions. Uh then then people
[18:23] began settling and monasteries um were
[18:26] formed and this distinction between
[18:28] monks and lay people grew grew very very
[18:32] strong quite strongly delineated. Um in
[18:35] our tradition we don't have that. Um we
[18:39] have um ordination as the Buddha had in
[18:42] his day. Um but we um the the maxim is
[18:46] that our lifestyle the commitment is
[18:48] what's important. So you could um yeah
[18:52] commitment is the primary thing and our
[18:54] lifestyle is secondary.
[18:57] What that means is that you can you
[19:00] don't have to um renounce everything to
[19:03] make progress and in fact you can
[19:05] renounce everything and not make
[19:06] progress. There's some songs of the
[19:08] early Buddhist nuns and monks who they
[19:11] sort of lament um they say you know I
[19:13] was wondering for 10 20 years my
[19:16] meditation was still rubbish. Um, and
[19:18] then, you know, eventually they find a
[19:20] good teacher and then they they gain
[19:21] insight. But, um, uh,
[19:25] there's good reasons to to renounce
[19:28] everything, but it doesn't necessarily
[19:30] mean everything. And, um,
[19:33] uh, you you know, there's also stories
[19:35] of bad monks, naughty monks, um,
[19:40] [laughter]
[19:41] even slightly evil ones causing all
[19:44] sorts of trouble. So, so you can't tell.
[19:46] What I'm trying to say is you can't tell
[19:48] just because someone's got a religious
[19:50] outfit. You can't tell how strong their
[19:52] practice is. Uh, and um, well, we can
[19:56] see from people's actions. That's what
[19:58] really that's what really makes a
[20:00] difference. That's what really makes a
[20:01] difference. Yeah.
[20:04] So, um, yes. So, we know our Buddhist
[20:06] movement, some people live just like,
[20:08] you know, work for the NHS or are
[20:11] teachers or run their own business with
[20:13] their family. Some people live much more
[20:15] um similarly to you know at retreat
[20:18] centers or even even quite remote
[20:22] retreat centers or here at the Buddhist
[20:23] center in a in a more sort of explicit
[20:25] Buddhist community. All all of that's
[20:27] possible.
[20:29] Yeah. So um
[20:38] so yeah she she um Visak Visaka had a
[20:44] good relationship with the Buddha and
[20:46] she spoke to him and had dialogue with
[20:47] him um many times in her life and um for
[20:52] instance one of her grandchildren died
[20:55] uh and she was beset with grief and uh
[20:58] uh the Buddha there encounter really
[21:01] helped her with her grief and um through
[21:04] that grief she was able to understand
[21:07] deeper realities of suffering. So that
[21:09] so that's one of the incidents a sort of
[21:12] spiritual watershed in her life. Um and
[21:16] as I said the Buddha said that she was
[21:19] foremost in generosity. Um she's already
[21:22] laid the ground but what she did um with
[21:26] her piece of jewelry is the next is the
[21:28] next piece of the story. So, um, she
[21:31] went to listen to the Buddha teaching
[21:35] and she had her piece of jewelry with
[21:37] her, which I don't I don't know if she
[21:40] was wearing it as a giant golden peacock
[21:42] and listening to the Buddha teaching or
[21:44] if she the maid was carrying it. Anyway,
[21:46] somehow the maid left it behind um in
[21:50] the kind of forum where the Buddha was
[21:52] teaching uh and it got forgotten
[21:55] [snorts] um and then she rushed back to
[21:58] find it and uh Anander who was the
[22:00] Buddha's attendant had picked it up and
[22:03] was had had put it away like this is
[22:05] obviously very precious so he'd kept it
[22:08] um and when she found out that um Arnad
[22:12] one of the monks had um touched it and
[22:15] been keeping it. She felt like she
[22:17] couldn't take it back. So, Visaka
[22:20] couldn't take it back because it'd been
[22:21] handled by one of the reverent members
[22:24] of the SA. It now she felt that it now
[22:26] belonged to um the Buddha and his
[22:28] retinue. Um so, very strong sort of
[22:32] sense of propriety there. Um but what do
[22:35] the what do the monks and nuns need with
[22:37] a a giant golden peacock outfit? They um
[22:40] they didn't need it and they didn't know
[22:42] what to do with it. And also so they
[22:45] they tried to sell it but no one in the
[22:47] land was rich enough to buy it. So they
[22:49] they went and sort of got it valued and
[22:51] it was valued at priceless. So how
[22:54] [laughter]
[22:55] um so no one in the land was rich enough
[22:57] to buy it. So the only person who could
[22:59] do it so she decided she would liquidate
[23:01] all her assets and buy it from the SA.
[23:05] So she'd given the golden peacock and
[23:07] then she bought it back. She bought it
[23:09] back. Um, and what she did with that,
[23:15] what they did with the money was, um,
[23:17] they decided to build, uh, in Savvati,
[23:22] the town where she was living, um, a
[23:24] place that the Buddha and his retinue
[23:26] could go in a in a bit of empty
[23:28] parkland, they built a place that they
[23:32] could come in the rainy season. Um, and
[23:35] that was funded by the golden um,
[23:38] peacock, [clears throat] but really it
[23:40] was funded by her liquidating all her
[23:42] other assets. And um, well, I think
[23:46] there's great symbolism in that in that
[23:48] piece of jewelry
[23:50] in that it was made for her dowy. So, it
[23:53] symbolized her as a wife. It symbolized
[23:56] her as a a wealthy person, a well-known
[23:59] person. Um so it yeah it symbolized all
[24:04] her status wealth her so many people had
[24:08] contributed to the making of it by um
[24:12] yeah helping with the fuel that she was
[24:14] so celebrated and her giving that away
[24:17] um or trying to I mean it she did have
[24:21] to buy it back but she she did really
[24:23] want the sanger to have it it's sort of
[24:24] her saying that like none of that's as
[24:26] important nothing's as important really
[24:29] as what the Buddha is trying to do and
[24:30] and his teaching and and the effect of
[24:33] the dharma on human beings. Um so very
[24:36] very strong um renunciation and
[24:40] generosity there and well what's yes so
[24:44] she she built this place and the
[24:46] historic it it still remains the
[24:49] historical remains the archaeological
[24:51] remains are still there in sovereignty
[24:52] they're not that well looked after
[24:54] apparently um but they're there and
[24:56] there's a sort of mound um commemorating
[24:59] her her generous gift
[25:02] um
[25:04] Yes. And maybe I'll just say something
[25:09] more.
[25:20] Well, okay. So, maybe I'll just say
[25:23] something a little bit more about about
[25:26] generosity. Um because it might be quite
[25:30] easy to think um that someone so wealthy
[25:34] as her, well, of course it's easy for
[25:36] her to give away all of these things. Um
[25:39] but she she kept doing it and um uh you
[25:44] know it it it's quite easy to think when
[25:47] people are very wealthy like uh oh well
[25:50] selling a few houses or something, you
[25:52] know, that's that's just easy for them.
[25:54] But she she really did um give up a lot.
[25:58] Um and uh one of the apparently one of
[26:02] the basic in certain aspects of Buddhism
[26:06] and I think this runs true actually
[26:07] through all but it's articulated in
[26:09] certain um areas of Buddhism that the
[26:12] that dhana which is this word for giving
[26:15] or generosity is a preliminary to all
[26:18] other practice. So in Buddhism we have
[26:20] the three-fold path which is a sort of
[26:23] the simplest um road map really to
[26:25] practice which is you practice ethics,
[26:28] you practice meditation and uh you
[26:32] practice and uh gain wisdom. So the
[26:35] three-fold path is ethics, meditation,
[26:38] wisdom. Underpinning that is generosity
[26:42] is giving um dhana um and yeah it's
[26:47] known by our teacher. He says it's the
[26:49] basic Buddhist virtue. Giving is the
[26:51] basic Buddhist virtue. So I thought I've
[26:54] been talking for a while. I thought
[26:56] maybe you could just get into threes and
[26:59] just talk about why do you think this
[27:02] quality of generosity dhana is the basic
[27:05] Buddhist virtue? Like why do you think
[27:08] it's that and not I don't know
[27:10] meditation or um uh yeah other kindness
[27:16] or something like that? Why is it
[27:18] generosity?
[27:20] Okay, great. So, um be great if some of
[27:23] you could tell me what you came up with.
[27:25] Why do you think it's a basic Buddhist
[27:28] virtue?
[27:34] >> Yeah.
[27:34] >> Um yeah, we were um there were a few
[27:37] points raised, but like one of them was
[27:38] about um how being generous means that
[27:42] you no longer see as much distinction
[27:44] between yourself, other people.
[27:46] >> Yeah. Um yeah because you know you're g
[27:49] to given to them they're going to feel
[27:51] joy you're going to feel joy and all of
[27:54] a sudden you know it doesn't really
[27:55] matter whatever you gave right or the
[27:58] cause and conditions which led to you
[27:59] having that you know the thing to give
[28:03] it's you stop having the distinction.
[28:06] >> Yeah great yeah and and is that your
[28:08] experience that like when you give
[28:09] something you get joy and the other
[28:11] person gets joy is it
[28:13] >> uh yeah I had a give an example of I was
[28:17] I was talking to an honest person for
[28:18] like for like an hour and a bit a while
[28:21] ago and that felt like I was being
[28:24] generous, you know,
[28:25] >> you you were what with
[28:27] >> I was talking to
[28:28] >> Oh, yeah.
[28:28] >> for like an hour and a bit a while ago
[28:31] and I felt like I was being generous
[28:32] with my time,
[28:34] >> you know,
[28:34] >> cuz I don't normally do that.
[28:36] >> Yeah.
[28:36] >> Um and and it was a great conversation.
[28:38] It was it was very um and again that did
[28:41] again break down the barriers of of you
[28:44] know there's some myself and like stop
[28:47] that distinction.
[28:48] >> Yeah.
[28:49] >> Yeah. Great. Thanks. Thanks. A lovely
[28:51] example. Yeah. What um what else? Why
[28:55] else do you think Buddhism is the basic
[28:57] Buddhist
[28:59] generosity? Not just financial
[29:01] generosity, but time, kindness, effort.
[29:06] >> Yeah.
[29:07] >> That it's very accessible. Anybody can
[29:09] give kindness for example.
[29:11] >> Yes. Yeah. So, yeah, that's great that
[29:13] it's very accessible. Yeah, exactly. Um
[29:17] and um yeah, our teacher, he points this
[29:20] he points out exactly what you've said
[29:22] that it might be um you know, you can't
[29:26] it might be that you're just going
[29:28] through a really bad patch in meditation
[29:30] and maybe your ethics are a bit all over
[29:32] the place. Um you just generally don't
[29:34] feel like a good Buddhist. Uh but you
[29:36] can always um give you can always think
[29:40] about other people and uh give something
[29:43] like it's it's like an excellent
[29:45] starting point and something that's
[29:46] always accessible. Yeah. Great.
[29:50] >> Yeah. I think the conclusion that we
[29:51] came to is that had it not been for
[29:54] generosity, we would not be sitting here
[29:56] today and listening to the dharma and
[30:00] like getting this wisdom and like you
[30:02] being s like sat here and just
[30:04] communicating the knowledge that you
[30:06] have. So it's very much this force that
[30:09] has allowed us as a species to like
[30:13] >> get access to this form of knowledge.
[30:16] And it's also like the love and it's
[30:18] like love and generosity. They like come
[30:20] hand in hand
[30:22] >> somehow and allow all of this to happen.
[30:25] >> Yeah. Great. That's really nice. So it
[30:27] Yeah. It's almost like even preceding
[30:30] generosity is noticing that what we've
[30:33] been given and that that Yeah. A quality
[30:36] of gratitude um awareness of what we've
[30:38] been given as well. Yeah. And of course
[30:41] Buddhism uh is here now in the
[30:45] contemporary world because of that.
[30:47] Yeah. Yeah. Lovely. Yeah. Any any more
[30:51] points,
[30:53] >> thoughts? What you touched on was uh
[30:56] yeah, it just sort of makes us feel good
[30:58] to do it. So to contribute to life is
[31:03] something that raises one's self-esteem
[31:05] as well. And then that sort of feeds
[31:07] into maybe having better meditation and
[31:10] um yeah and and just being connected to
[31:13] a wider group of people.
[31:16] >> Yeah. Great. Yeah. Yeah. So sort of sort
[31:18] of psychologically healthy like just
[31:20] good self-esteem connect feeling
[31:22] connected. Yeah. Yeah. Really nice. Um
[31:27] yeah. So giving um uh we all agree
[31:32] uh is seem to agree that it it's
[31:35] definitely worthwhile doing. And um I
[31:38] just thought I'd say a little bit about
[31:40] about this and
[31:44] um well how to give in Buddhism. Um
[31:47] actually there's reams and reams that
[31:49] have been written and spoken about about
[31:51] this but uh just a couple of points that
[31:54] I want to make. Um when giving um what
[31:58] was need what um
[32:01] uh what happened was that um well when
[32:06] giving to really take in people's real
[32:09] needs and um yeah not not just sort of
[32:15] give for ulterior motives um like give
[32:19] to flatter people or give with strings
[32:22] attached. when we're giving, we give. We
[32:24] notice what people need and we give it
[32:27] to them. So this is what happened is she
[32:29] um realized that it would be of benefit
[32:32] to the Buddha and his SA if they had a
[32:33] rainy season retreat, a place that they
[32:36] could go and a place a place is
[32:38] important, isn't it? It's like
[32:43] I mean in some ways you could say well
[32:44] that's just another worldly thing. Um
[32:46] but what it means is that people know
[32:48] where to find the Buddha uh and listen
[32:51] to him. Um and it means that uh year
[32:54] after year he could come back with his
[32:56] um disciples and um that that could
[33:00] build up a sense of community which is
[33:02] very positive. So she realized that this
[33:05] was needed and um so she really took in
[33:10] uh people's needs and actually um
[33:13] there's this even more beautiful
[33:15] teaching about her. So um she uh said to
[33:19] the Buddha, she basically she noticed
[33:21] quite a few things um that the Buddhist
[33:24] uh the the monks and nuns needed. Let me
[33:27] just find where I've written them down.
[33:29] Um
[33:31] yeah, so Vizaka, she said to the Buddha
[33:34] one day, um she said, "I I'd like to ask
[33:38] you a favor." And the Buddha said,
[33:39] "Well, Buddhas don't don't grant
[33:42] favors." She said, "But it's a good one.
[33:44] [laughter]
[33:45] it it's favorable. Um and um so she
[33:50] Oh yes, she said it's allowable and
[33:52] blameless. So he said okay fine. Um and
[33:56] so she said that she would wanted to
[33:58] give rainy season robes to the SA. When
[34:01] she says the SA she means the monks and
[34:02] nuns. Um and she wants to give meals to
[34:06] the newly arrived ones um and to the
[34:09] departing ones. And she also wanted to
[34:12] give uh meals to those who are sick and
[34:15] those who are nursing the sick. And she
[34:18] also wants to give medicines to the
[34:19] sick, a regular supply of um milk um
[34:25] rice milk or something. And she wanted
[34:27] to give bathing robes [clears throat] to
[34:28] the nuns. And um uh
[34:33] she uh and then she lists the reasons.
[34:36] And she what she does is she's
[34:37] articulating what she's noticed. um that
[34:40] she doesn't think that the the monks
[34:42] should go around um naked in the rainy
[34:45] season. I don't quite I don't quite
[34:46] understand why they were, but anyway, or
[34:49] if they were. There's some things like
[34:51] when stories are 2,500 years old, you
[34:54] can't always get some of the the the
[34:56] details, but so um she wanted she didn't
[35:00] want them to have to be naked. Um, and
[35:04] uh, she also with the the newly arrived
[35:07] monks and the departing monks,
[35:10] um, when people are newly arrived, they
[35:12] don't know their way around town. It's
[35:14] quite hard to go begging for arms. So
[35:15] that's how they'd normally get their
[35:16] meals. And if they're departing and they
[35:18] had somewhere to go, they had to do an
[35:20] arms round and then leave. Um, that's
[35:22] quite tiring. So she noticed this. Uh,
[35:25] she wanted them to avoid getting
[35:28] exhausted. and um and she noticed that
[35:31] not only do sick people need nutrition,
[35:33] but the people caring for the sick
[35:35] people. Um so she noticed the carers the
[35:38] carers needed caring for. Um and uh also
[35:43] she what else did she notice? Um
[35:46] um and that they needed suitable
[35:49] medicines and they might um were get
[35:51] worse if they didn't have them. Um so
[35:53] she wanted to help them. And she also
[35:56] noticed that um when the nuns were um
[35:58] bathing in the nearby river um they
[36:01] would uh they would get teased by the
[36:03] other women who would say, "Oh, you
[36:05] know, why don't you you're all young and
[36:06] beautiful. Why are you renouncing the
[36:08] world?" Um when when you could have fun
[36:12] like us. Um and so she so she bought
[36:15] them like bathing robes so she they
[36:17] could bathe in the river um without
[36:18] getting teased by the other women. So
[36:21] the Buddha um said well yes of course
[36:23] you can do this um and she said she
[36:27] wanted to offer this um
[36:30] uh not just once but for the rest of her
[36:32] life. She wanted to keep giving like
[36:34] this for the rest of her life. So um so
[36:38] this is exactly that like noticing
[36:41] people's real needs and isn't that
[36:44] satisfying? I mean if you reflect on
[36:46] just keeping aware of what someone wants
[36:48] um rather than um
[36:53] I mean I yeah sometimes um I was just
[36:56] thinking sometimes uh I don't know if
[36:58] you know the charity shop the Buddhist
[36:59] center charity shop around the corner I
[37:01] often go there thinking I'll buy a
[37:03] present for so and so then I I only
[37:05] notice things that I like and I want for
[37:07] myself
[37:10] [laughter]
[37:10] but rather than doing that and get and
[37:14] getting presents that you want actually
[37:16] yourself actually taking in the other
[37:18] person and and getting what would help
[37:21] them in in their own lives.
[37:24] And then she she follows up. Um so the
[37:29] Buddhist asks her what what why would
[37:31] she want to do these things and she says
[37:33] the benefit to the people she's giving
[37:35] to and then he asks her well what's the
[37:37] benefit to you and what she describes is
[37:41] um a a really beautifully positive uh
[37:45] kind of spiritually augmentative
[37:48] um uplift of mind. So here here we go.
[37:51] She says um if I give to the if I give
[37:55] to the
[37:58] give all of these things
[38:00] um these eight boons they're called if
[38:03] when I recall that I've given them I'll
[38:05] be glad. So this is what some of you
[38:07] have said um about giving. And then she
[38:09] said the gladness will give rise to joy
[38:13] and the mental joy will make me
[38:14] tranquil. Um, and when I'm tranquil,
[38:18] I'll feel bliss. And when I'm blissful,
[38:21] my mind will be stilled. And in this
[38:24] way, I'll develop spiritual faculties,
[38:26] the spiritual powers, and the factors of
[38:29] awakening. It's because of this benefit
[38:32] that I ask for these eight favors.
[38:36] Okay. So, what she's articulated here is
[38:39] um a traditional Buddhist teaching uh or
[38:43] that we call the spiral path. So um what
[38:47] happens um very often if uh in our m
[38:51] very often when we're not uh acting
[38:54] positively in the way she described our
[38:56] minds just ricochet from um greed to
[39:00] annoyance to jealousy to greed again um
[39:04] uh all over with a bit of pleasure at
[39:07] some point and you know maybe an
[39:09] accidental dash of kindness. But what
[39:11] she's describing um is uh if we work on
[39:15] our minds um what naturally happens is
[39:19] one positive mental state we keep
[39:21] working on our minds gives rise and
[39:23] overflows into the next and this is
[39:26] known as the spiritual the sorry the the
[39:28] spiral path um and
[39:32] yeah um there's two there's two parts of
[39:36] it so she describes gladness joy uh all
[39:40] of these
[39:41] They're sort of like cups overflowing
[39:43] into the next cup. Uh you could think of
[39:45] it in that way. Um mental joy she says
[39:49] uh leading to tranquility and this is
[39:51] the tranquility of meditation. So I
[39:54] think this is what um I think maybe you
[39:57] mentioned this Pete that like when we
[39:59] give our minds we feel happier and when
[40:02] we're happy
[40:04] are sort of more psychologically
[40:06] happy we're much more easily able to sit
[40:09] and concentrate because our mind's not
[40:11] running away from itself much more ease
[40:13] in the mind and joy. Um so this
[40:17] tranquility and that can lead to bliss.
[40:19] So we sit for longer. Um the mind
[40:22] becomes more healthy, more sort of
[40:24] glowing, more aware, more loving. Um
[40:27] leads to bliss. Uh and the bliss can be
[40:30] still into a very very deep peace. So
[40:32] this is traditional um stages of
[40:35] meditation.
[40:38] With that kind of mind that's been
[40:40] worked on um in that way, uh then one's
[40:44] able to really make spiritual progress.
[40:45] So she goes then into the spiritual
[40:47] faculties, powers and factors of
[40:49] awakening. So this then leads to
[40:52] insight. And um when we say insight uh
[40:56] we're talking about becoming much closer
[40:59] to the Buddha's vision of the world. And
[41:01] the Buddha's vision of the world, if I
[41:02] I'll bring it back to giving, is
[41:05] something like um
[41:09] yes, something like uh when when we give
[41:14] uh we start off when we start off
[41:16] giving, we think I'm going to give this
[41:19] to you. Um and that's really positive
[41:22] because we start thinking about you
[41:25] rather than me.
[41:27] >> [laughter]
[41:27] >> Um and the Buddha's vision of the world
[41:29] is that that that sense of me and you uh
[41:33] self and other is completely eroded. The
[41:35] distinction between gift, giver, um
[41:38] receiver, all of that um is just a kind
[41:42] of a beautiful flow of of awareness and
[41:46] energy and um u profound clarity and
[41:50] love. Um, so this is why really she
[41:55] wants to give. She wants to give. Well,
[41:58] she wants to give because she's spotted
[42:00] the real needs of others. Her own
[42:02] selfishness is wearing away. Um, she's
[42:05] becoming more and more um well uh making
[42:09] more and more spiritual progress if we
[42:11] can if we can use these words.
[42:15] Yeah. So, um really that that's um
[42:18] there's lots more um funny little
[42:21] incidents in her life, but I think
[42:22] that's the main the main things that I
[42:24] want to tell you about um that this is
[42:28] how she saw her life is one of giving
[42:31] and [clears throat] um this positive
[42:33] movement towards awakening and she did
[42:36] that um uh in her own life, in her town
[42:42] uh in relation to her family and um uh
[42:46] sort of yeah a major sponsor or patron
[42:50] of the Buddha and the SA herself. So she
[42:53] made a massive a massive contribution to
[42:54] Buddhism. Many many um teachings from
[42:58] the uh early texts are said uh they um
[43:02] the place where she said is the eastern
[43:04] park. Um so they might start like thus
[43:07] have I heard while the Buddha was
[43:09] resting in the the eastern park or the
[43:12] park of the east. Um uh so many
[43:14] important teachings were given in that
[43:16] place. Um
[43:18] uh yes uh the the mindfulness of
[43:21] breathing in fact the meditation there
[43:23] for example was taught there. Um and
[43:25] that's you know she she enabled all of
[43:28] that to happen. uh he would have taught
[43:30] it anyway but um
[43:33] uh
[43:35] a a place is important because we can go
[43:38] there like you've come tonight.
[43:41] um in the middle of the night the Buddha
[43:43] would um he didn't sleep very much
[43:46] actually and the he had a very strong
[43:49] routine when he was staying in that park
[43:51] um in that building and um he probably
[43:55] had his own little hut actually but uh
[43:58] he had a strong routine so he'd go
[43:59] around the town he'd visit the other
[44:01] side there was another place where he
[44:02] sometimes stayed um and uh he'd teach in
[44:07] the evenings then he'd do m um walking
[44:10] meditation And at certain point, I think
[44:12] between midnight and um the early hours
[44:15] when everyone else is asleep, that's
[44:17] when the the davvers, which is the the
[44:19] sort of celestial beings and local
[44:21] spirits and uh angelic beings would come
[44:24] down and visit him. Um so they did that
[44:26] in the eastern park, come down and visit
[44:29] him and he would teach them the dharma.
[44:31] Then he'd have an hour's rest and then
[44:33] he'd get up and uh carry on. So um yes,
[44:37] so that's what happened in um Visaka's
[44:41] eastern park and that's what the Buddha
[44:43] was able to do because of her
[44:45] generosity.
[44:47] Okay. So um I hope uh well I hope that
[44:52] if there's one message just to think
[44:54] about uh the augmentative
[44:57] uh joy that she experienced from her own
[44:59] generosity. So you can think about that
[45:01] like over the week are there some
[45:04] opportunities to give uh as your
[45:06] fundamental Buddhist practice and see
[45:09] what happens and then we hope to see you
[45:11] next week when Ste Manis is going to
[45:14] introduce us to another of the Buddhist
[45:16] disciples.