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Inspiration

The Bow Test: Odyssey, Ramayana, and the Book of Enoch

NL
Next Level Soul
Oct 17, 2026
8 min read
Watch · 8

A longbow sits across a host's lap on a Zoom call, a gift still fresh enough that the guest is itching to shoot it. Robert Edward Grant has spent the past two weeks inside the Book of Enoch, and the host has noticed. Before any scripture is opened, the conversation takes a sideways turn into Hollywood, then into India, then into the sky above the pyramids. The bow is the hinge. In Grant's telling, a contest of stringing a bow is one of the oldest ways humanity has tested who is fit to rule, and the same test surfaces in the Odyssey, the Ramayana, and, by way of a constellation, the ancient material around Enoch. This is a 58-minute conversation on Next Level Soul, and what follows is an attempt to lay out its argument carefully, because the connections are bold and the reader deserves to see where the evidence ends and the interpretation begins.

Read · 8 sections

Why is the Book of Enoch suddenly everywhere?

The host opens with a question that many readers are asking: why now? Grant does not answer directly. He answers with a question of his own, asking why the Odyssey became one of the biggest films of the summer. His explanation has two parts. The first is the director. Grant credits Christopher Nolan with a reservoir of what he calls "cinema karma and credibility," saying that a filmmaker with that track record could draw an audience to nearly anything. The second is the appetite for older stories. He describes the Odyssey as a story that "was haunting, and it stuck with me," and argues that audiences are hungry for narratives that linger after the credits, something he says is rarer in the modern studio system than it was in the 1990s.

The logic matters because it sets up the method of the whole conversation. Grant treats popularity as a signal that people are sensing something older and deeper underneath the surface of a story. The Book of Enoch, in his view, is one of those stories waiting to be heard again. The host adds a detail that is worth holding onto: he says the book is part of the Ethiopian biblical canon, and that its absence from other Bibles reflects removal rather than mere neglect. That claim is the host's, not an established consensus, and it is presented in the episode as one of the questions the hosts are chewing on.

What does a bow have to do with kingship?

This is the scene that gives the episode its spine. In the Odyssey, Odysseus returns home disguised as a beggar. His wife Penelope, who does not recognize him, sets a challenge for the suitors who have overrun the household: whoever can string the great bow and shoot an arrow through a line of axe heads wins her hand. Grant reads the moment as an ancient test of legitimacy, and he lays it beside a parallel from India.

"In the Ramayana, Rama basically has to prove that he's worthy of being king, and the way he has to prove that he's worthy of being king is he has to string the bow of Shiva." (Robert Edward Grant, Next Level Soul)

The structure is what interests him. In the Ramayana, Rama breaks the bow of Shiva, which begins his path to kingship. In the Odyssey, the bow proves the returning king's identity and reclaims his throne. Grant frames both as the opening and closing of one cycle: a hero is lost, tested, and restored. "It's like the beginning of a cycle," he says in effect, and the reclaiming of kingship in the Odyssey is the second half of the same arc. He also notes the Latin name, Ulysses, and draws a personal thread, explaining that he was named after both Ulysses S. Grant and Robert E. Lee, a pair of Civil War generals. The personal aside is a small one, but it reveals how Grant thinks: he sees patterns through names, figures, and inherited roles.

For a reader, the craft lesson here is the difference between a motif and a lineage. A motif is a shared image, like a bow or a test of strength, that appears across cultures. A lineage argues that the images descend from a common source. Grant leans toward the second reading, and the rest of the episode is an attempt to find the source.

Why does Orion keep showing up at sacred sites?

The hinge from the bow to the stars comes through a constellation. Grant argues that Orion appears in virtually every sacred site around the world, and he says that: "There is one very, very large constellation that we have in the sky that shows up in virtually almost every sacred site around the world, and it is Orion." Depictions of the figure vary in what he holds. Some show a club, some a fleece, and others a bow and arrow. Grant reads these variations as the same hero seen through different cultures, and he points to naming differences, including a Hungarian tradition that calls the figure Nimrod, a name he also connects to the Bible.

Whether the reader accepts this depends on how strongly they want to test it. Orion is among the most widely recognized star patterns across human history, and many cultures did tell stories about it. The leap Grant makes is from shared star patterns to a shared hero and then to a shared spiritual narrative. That leap is the core of his interpretation, and the episode presents it as his reading rather than as settled fact.

What is the Watchers story, and where does Noah's Ark fit?

The Book of Enoch is best known for the Watchers, a group of angels who descended to earth and, in the traditional account, taught humans forbidden knowledge. The episode's description lists the Watchers, the Nephilim, and the flood narratives among its topics, and the excerpt shows Grant describing angels who came to earth and taught esoteric knowledge. For Grant, the flood is not a separate story. He reads the Enoch material as tied to the same cataclysm that Noah survives, and the host's question about whether a reported discovery could be Noah's Ark shows how the two threads meet in the present.

The conversation then moves to a reported Ark discovery, and the hosts discuss core samples and how the claim is being evaluated. The timing interests the host. The hosts treat the claim as open rather than confirmed. For readers, the key point is that the episode does not present a verified find. It presents an invitation to hold the claim, the timeline, and the ancient text side by side and see whether they line up.

What role do sacred geometry and the pyramids play?

Grant ties the stars to architecture. The episode discusses the pyramids of Egypt, including measurements of the Pyramid of the Moon, and it links those measurements to celestial alignments and to calendars based on 360 days. The reasoning is that ancient builders encoded knowledge in proportion, angle, and orientation, and that the same knowledge appears in texts like Enoch's. Sacred geometry becomes the language in which sky, flood, and temple speak to one another.

This is the part of the episode most open to testing, and a careful reader should check each claim against archaeological and astronomical sources. Measurements of pyramids are well documented, and alignments with stars are a real research field. The stronger claim, that a single lost knowledge system explains them all, is the interpretive frame Grant brings to the material, not a conclusion that the evidence forces.

How does Lucifer fit into this picture?

The episode also raises the origins of Lucifer, the Eye of Horus, and what the guest calls two possible paths for humanity's future. Grant questions how the Lucifer figure is described in various traditions and whether the devil as a character appears in the early Hebrew Bible. He returns to a point that runs through the whole conversation: much of this is interpretation. The same texts can be read in more than one way, and the meaning often depends on who is reading them and when.

How should a reader hold these ideas?

Near the end, Grant offers the stance that governs the whole episode. He says: "All I'm going to say to you, my friend, is I am open to..." The sentence is cut off in the transcript, but the posture is clear. He is inviting a conversation, not handing down a verdict. The Enoch material, the Ark claim, the Orion pattern, and the bow contests are each worth investigating on their own terms. The value of the episode lies in its questions: why do so many cultures reach for the same images of a test, a hero, and a cataclysm? Why does a story about angels and flood keep returning when people feel the strain of living in a world that does not quite fit their sense of meaning?

Where to go from here

Read the Odyssey and the Ramayana side by side and notice how each handles the bow scene. Then read a translation of the Book of Enoch, paying attention to the Watchers and the flood, and compare it with the Ethiopian biblical tradition that the host points to. Look at Orion in a star chart, then at its depictions across cultures. Finally, check the Ark claim and the pyramid measurements against primary reporting and scholarly sources, not only against the episode. Grant's conversation is a starting point. The reader's own comparison is where the story becomes real.

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Transcript

[0:00] Why do you think the Book of Enoch is suddenly everywhere

[0:03] right now?

[0:04] Someone has to be strong enough to string his bow and shoot the

[0:09] arrow through the 12 axes and hit the target. Now, this is all

[0:14] related to Enoch. You just didn't know it. This is the

[0:17] story, and it's the story of Enoch transcending. And is there

[0:21] some sort of big cataclysm coming? Maybe in one of the

[0:24] versions of Earth, I can tell you the way it's connected.

[0:27] There is one very, very large constellation that we have in

[0:30] the sky that shows up in virtually almost every sacred

[0:34] site around the world, and it is Orion. Of course, the flood

[0:39] plays a role in this. Enoch was alive at the time of the flood.

[0:42] So, do you believe that what they found is Noah's Ark?

[0:44] I do find that the timing of all this is very interesting,

[0:47] though, because...

[0:58] I like to welcome back to the show returning champion Robert

[1:01] Edward Grant, how you doing, brother?

[1:02] Hey, Alex, how are you?

[1:04] I'm good, man. I'm good. Good to see you, man. Well, first of

[1:09] all, thanks for obviously be back on the show. I don't know.

[1:12] This makes I think seven episode seven that you've been on with

[1:14] me. Well, yeah, it's it's been a bunch. You've been in studio a

[1:19] few times, but you're a busy man flying around the world doing a

[1:22] lot of stuff. So I I got you on Zoom this time. Hopefully next

[1:25] time you're in Austin you can swing by. But sir, you know

[1:29] there's been a lot of stuff, a lot of things going on in the

[1:33] world. But one thing I wanted to kind of dive into with you this

[1:36] in this conversation is something that I found out just

[1:40] a few moments ago, that you have been actively reading for the

[1:44] last two weeks, and I just said, "Hey, man, I want to talk about

[1:47] the Book of Enoch. I really haven't had a real deep

[1:51] conversation about the Book of Enoch, and you're like, "How the

[1:53] hell do you know that I've been reading the Book of Enoch?

[1:55] You're monitoring me.

[2:00] I hacked into your AI, sir, and it's actually seeing everything

[2:04] you're doing.

[2:05] Wow!

[2:07] So, so

[2:08] Not very interesting. What if you could see everything I did?

[2:10] You'd probably be like, "That's pretty boring, man. It's like,

[2:14] Is he is he reading? Is he reading again? Oh God!

[2:17] Yeah, exactly.

[2:20] So, so let me ask you: Why do you think the Book of Enoch is

[2:24] suddenly everywhere right now? It's one of those things that's

[2:26] on the top of a lot of people's lists, and people are interested

[2:30] in it. And is it is one of those books that was removed from the

[2:34] Bible? Some people say left out, but I say it was physically

[2:38] removed because it is, if I'm not mistaken, in the Ethiopian

[2:41] version of the Bible, it is in that Bible. So, what? Why do you

[2:45] think the Book of Enoch? Before we get into what it is, why do

[2:48] you think it's everywhere right now? A lot of people are asking

[2:50] about it.

[2:51] I think the answer to your question is actually a question:

[2:56] Why do you think the Odyssey became the biggest hit movie

[3:00] this summer? And I know you're a movie buff, so

[3:02] I mean I've seen it twice already, and in the theater. And

[3:07] I believe that that well, there's two reasons. One, and

[3:11] the the most important, Chris Nolan. Chris Nolan has so much

[3:15] good good karma, cinema karma that he could basically

[3:20] And credibility.

[3:22] Yeah, that's cinema karma and credibility go hand in hand.

[3:25] Because of him as a filmmaker, he's done so many amazing movies

[3:29] over the last two decades that he could pretty much show up and

[3:34] read the yellow pages, and someone's going to pay a ticket

[3:36] to see it because it's Chris Nolan. I mean, he did look what

[3:39] he did with Oppenheimer. I mean, that's ridiculous. A you know a

[3:42] physicist, you know, and and it turned into a billion. So what

[3:46] he did with the Odyssey is amazing. So I think a return

[3:51] back to these older stories is another reason. Is people were

[3:54] like, wow, there is so much. The Odyssey for me was haunting, and

[3:59] it stuck with me. And movies that stick with you after you

[4:02] watch it and doesn't let go, that I pay attention to, and

[4:06] that's rare nowadays. You don't see that as often. It used to

[4:09] happen a lot in the '90s, especially in the '90s with like

[4:12] Fight Club and The Matrix and and those even Pulp Fiction.

[4:15] Like those movies kind of just stuck with you and just kept

[4:18] replaying in your head because they had these stories were so

[4:21] deep, where now you don't get as much of that from the studio

[4:24] system. So he's a rare, a rare bird to be able to do what he's

[4:28] doing. There's a handful of directors who could do that, but

[4:30] he's arguably the the only one. If Spielberg would have made or

[4:34] Scorsese would have made the Odyssey, it would have done

[4:37] okay, but it wouldn't have become a phenomenon. It just

[4:39] wouldn't have, in my opinion.

[4:40] I have another question for you. Then there's a big movie coming

[4:44] out this fall, next month. Actually, yeah, next month. That

[4:48] is coming out of Bollywood. That is related to the Odyssey. Do

[4:53] you know what it is?

[4:54] I don't. I don't. What's the name?

[4:56] The Ramayana.

[4:58] Oh, I heard. Yeah, I have heard of the Ramayana. Yeah, is that?

[5:00] Coming out here?

[5:01] That's coming out worldwide. Yeah. Oh it's coming out

[5:04] worldwide now. How are these two stories connected? And I want to

[5:08] get something if I can. So hold on one second. Yeah.

[5:14] Oh, of course, of course, the bow. Yes, the bow. Yes.

[5:20] So now, this is a real old. It's a it's a it's a newly made, but

[5:20] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[5:21] I got this as a gift. Had the came whole thing. It was like

[5:27] it's a longbow made in the ancient style. It's a legit one,

[5:32] right? Yeah, legit.

[5:36] someone sent it to me. It was amazing. I was like, whoa, this

[5:39] is epic. And I actually shoot it and everything. And these are

[5:41] real, like wooden arrows with the the real

[5:44] Feathers and yeah yeah yeah

[5:45] Old school everything. So you remember in the movie The

[5:50] Odyssey, in the beginning it shows him and he's like making

[5:55] this bow, and then he does this thing. Of course, it has a more

[6:00] cinematic sound to it.

[6:03] Yeah, yeah,

[6:05] Right. So good, and and then of course at the end when he

[6:09] returns as a beggar, cloaked, he he has to he's given the

[6:16] challenge by his wife Penelope, who doesn't know that he is

[6:20] Odysseus, and the challenge is to all the suitors that were

[6:24] basically overrunning his kingdom. Someone has to be

[6:28] strong enough to string his bow and shoot the arrow through the

[6:33] 12 axes and hit the target. Right now, that is actually

[6:40] smacking of an ancient story, also, but it's slightly

[6:44] different, and both are related to gaining kingship. In the

[6:49] Ramayana, Rama basically has to prove that he's worthy of being

[6:54] king, and the way he has to prove that he's worthy of being

[6:56] king is he has to string the bow of Shiva.

[7:02] Okay.

[7:02] Now this is all related to Enoch. You just didn't know it.

[7:06] Okay.

[7:06] And stringing the bow of Shiva, and what happens in the

[7:09] Ramayana? Rama is so strong he breaks the bow of Shiva. Right,

[7:14] and so that begins the process where he becomes the king. So

[7:18] it's like the beginning of a cycle, and then he has to go

[7:22] through this whole cycle of being lost, and then come back

[7:25] and reclaim his kingship. And the reclaiming of kingship is

[7:28] what we see in the story of the Odyssey, and the Roman version

[7:32] of this, right? The Latin version would be Ulysses, which

[7:35] is kind of interesting because that relates to me. There's a

[7:37] very famous Grant in history, my namesake, and his name is

[7:41] Ulysses or U.S. Grant. He won the war, the Civil War, versus

[7:46] Robert Edward Lee, and I was named after both of these Civil

[7:49] War generals.

[7:50] Wow. Okay. Right. Wow.

[7:53] So there's a great Netflix documentary on Grant. Really

[7:56] worth watching.

[7:58] All right.

[7:58] It shows how he wins this war. So this is somehow related to

[8:06] Enoch, and I can tell you the way it's connected. There is one

[8:09] very, very large constellation that we have in the sky that

[8:12] shows up in virtually almost every sacred site around the

[8:16] world, and it is Orion. Now, certain depictions of Orion have

[8:22] Orion with a club, and other depictions, and he's holding a

[8:26] fleece, and other depictions have Orion holding a bow and

[8:29] arrow, right? So this is the same, you know, hero throughout

[8:34] time. In Hungary, it was referred to as Nimrod. Nimrod's

[8:40] also referenced in the Bible, in in Mesopotamia, it's more

[8:46] related to Hike. Haik is also the same kind of a great hunter.

[8:52] Then we also have the story of Orion and Artemis, and Artemis

[8:55] kills Orion inadvertently or accidentally because of her

[8:59] brother Apollo. Then we also have Osiris is the same

[9:02] constellation. Osiris and Isis are the two constellations, and

[9:07] by the way, Shiva and Shakti are the exact same constellations.

[9:13] In the story of Ramayana, it starts off he's with Sita.

[9:17] They're in a forest, and they see this golden deer, and next

[9:21] thing you know, he's off chasing the golden deer with a bow and

[9:23] arrow. So this is a symbology of something related to this

[9:30] evolution of mankind, going from holding a club, which is a very

[9:34] imprecise, blunt instrument, to the precision of a bow and

[9:39] arrow. Now this is interesting because the story of Enoch is

[9:45] also related to Orion, and Enoch is a man who becomes angelic.

[9:52] And we've talked about this before, right? We've had a

[9:54] podcast before. We talk about Enoch, and we talk about because

[9:57] you asked me about who is Thoth, who is. Yeah, Metatron. Who is

[10:02] you know? What is all the Saint Germain? All this stuff. What if

[10:05] I told you they're the all the same archetype?

[10:11] Okay,

[10:12] They're all the same archetype, and we see this in the hero's

[10:16] journey, the story of Orion, who even though the Vitruvian men,

[10:20] it's Orion. You've got Orion standing the Vitruvian Man by

[10:24] Leonardo da Vinci. If you look at his stomach, his abs are not

[10:27] just ripped. His abs have three diamonds on them. Why do they

[10:31] have three diamonds? Because those three diamonds represent

[10:33] the three belt stars of Orion. And if I showed it to you right

[10:37] now, you'd be like, "Whoa, what the heck? And if you look at his

[10:40] throat, Da Vinci drew his throat in the shape of a bull's head.

[10:45] Literally, has the shape of a bull's head because that's the

[10:47] Apis bull. Nandi represents Shiva. It's the Apis bull. The

[10:54] Shiva constellation, Orion constellation are all the same.

[10:57] Mount Meru, which I know you've probably heard of and studied,

[11:01] supposed to be the home of Shiva. Well, the original name

[11:03] of the Great Pyramid is Mer. If I spoke it in Japanese, it'd be

[11:07] pronounced Meru because it's a congluniative language that has

[11:12] to end in a vowel. So this story of Enoch is actually the story

[11:16] of man going through the hero's journey and forgetting that he's

[11:20] an angel and then remembering that he's an angel. This is why

[11:24] the book of Enoch is now showing up in all of our consciousness.

[11:28] Why did I all of a sudden start listening to the book of Enoch?

[11:30] I've read it before, but something told me to go back and

[11:33] study it in depth because this is the story of mankind's

[11:38] ascension. It's the story of us remembering who we are,

[11:42] And that's why the Odyssey is something.

[11:45] That's why the Odyssey is in the consciousness. That's why

[11:47] Ramayana is in the consciousness. That's why you

[11:50] asked me about the Book of Enoch, because it's all the same

[11:53] story.

[11:54] Interesting. So in the Book of Enoch, and and and tell

[11:58] everybody a little bit about the Book of Enoch. It's about an

[12:00] angel who forgets who he is and then is brought back.

[12:05] Well, in the story, basically, what it does, it's it's not

[12:08] telling it from the story or the context that he's an angel

[12:11] forgets who he is, but it does tell the story of how the

[12:15] beginning of the world began and how there were these fallen

[12:18] angels that came as well. They were teaching esoteric

[12:21] knowledge, and then, and and you have to basically parse out.

[12:24] Remember, this shows up in the Nakamadi text. This shows up,

[12:28] you know, in what we found in Qumran, right? But also, it was

[12:32] also in the Ethiopian Bible, and probably the the cleanest

[12:36] version of this. And none of this was canonized in the

[12:40] Council of Nicaea that happened, you know, around the third

[12:44] century A.D. when King, when when Emperor Constantine decided

[12:48] to convert to what they refer to as Catholicism, and then they

[12:51] said, "Oh, well, even though we we crucified Peter upside down

[12:56] in in the Vatican, we'll basically just say Peter was the

[12:59] first pope, and I'm just one of the lineage of that popehood,

[13:01] right? Of that's that's basically,

[13:04] Yeah, yeah.

[13:05] How it went down. So

[13:06] The politician would.

[13:08] That's right. They decided, yeah. If I can't beat them, I'll

[13:10] join them. Right. So they decided what books would end up

[13:13] in the Bible, what books would be excluded from the Bible. Not

[13:16] that they were saying that the the Book of Enoch was necessary

[13:20] heretical. Not that they were saying there was a radical text,

[13:23] but what they're saying is this is really not for virgin eyes.

[13:28] So someone who doesn't really understand spirituality, this is

[13:31] too much for them. You know, there's like talk of giants and

[13:35] floods, and you know, like having sex between like angels

[13:39] and men, and and what's going on here? And then they're teaching

[13:42] all kinds of strange stuff. And there's a whole giant section in

[13:44] there about a calendar. Why is all this stuff in here? Why also

[13:50] now, all of a sudden, in the last 24 hours, they've now

[13:53] declared in many media outlets that we found Noah's Ark.

[13:58] Yeah, I've heard about that. Is that we? Yeah, heard something

[14:02] about that that they they were drilling down. I saw some videos

[14:04] of it, and they're like, "This is it. And they look.

[14:08] So fora long time, people are like, "Wait a minute. The the

[14:11] biblical measurements, and remember, Enoch was was the

[14:14] grandfather of Noah. Right, he was the father of Methuselah. If

[14:20] we go back to the the Genesis account, so of course the flood

[14:25] plays a role in this. Enoch was alive at the time of the flood,

[14:29] supposed supposedly in the book of Genesis. So when we look at

[14:32] this, and you look at the story of Noah's Ark, Noah's Ark is

[14:34] supposed to be 300 cubits long, right? And it's supposed to be,

[14:42] which would be, you know, if we use the biblical cubit, which is

[14:46] one and a half feet, right? Then that's not matching the exact

[14:51] length of what the measured, you know, purported arc is on top of

[14:56] one of the mountains not far from Ararat. I think it's like

[14:59] 18 kilometers away. Or something like that, and it never said in

[15:03] the Bible that it landed on Mount Ararat. It said it landed

[15:06] on the Ararat Mountains. So, so they measured it. They're like,

[15:10] it doesn't really fit the measurement, but it does look

[15:12] like a boat. If you haven't seen it, it definitely looks kind of

[15:14] like a boat. It fits the description in many ways, and

[15:19] and then they realize, wait a minute, maybe we're using the

[15:21] wrong cubit measurement. They assumed it was one and a half

[15:24] feet. Maybe the cubit measurement is actually the

[15:26] Royal Egyptian cubit, the one that the pyramid was built on.

[15:30] And if you use that measurement, the measurements match

[15:32] perfectly. Turns out to be 157 meters exactly, which is half of

[15:37] pi. 1.5707 is is half of pi.

[15:42] So, do you believe what what they found is Noah's Ark?

[15:44] I do.

[15:46] Really,

[15:47] And it matches the height. So, you should get someone on your

[15:49] podcast to talk about this. But it matches the height, the 30

[15:52] cubits high, right? And the width is also matching. Now,

[15:55] what they just did is they did some core samples where they

[15:59] drilled in and they found the same structures as described,

[16:04] partitions, right, as described in the Bible of exactly the

[16:08] three stories of the Ark. So now, wait a minute. Why all of a

[16:14] sudden are we all coming back to these ancient stories of the

[16:18] flood, Enoch, you know the Ramayana, the story of Ulysses

[16:26] and Odyssey. The Odyssey. What's going on? It's the hero's

[16:30] journey. We're on the hero's journey, and we're going through

[16:34] the cycle of time.

[16:35] So right now, and for people who don't understand the hero's

[16:38] journey, I've studied that ad nauseum. Joseph Campbell came up

[16:43] with the hero's journey many many years ago, and is the basis

[16:46] of the most perfect execution of the hero's journey is probably

[16:49] Star Wars. It's it's pretty much just beat by beat perfect.

[16:55] By the way, I watched every Star Wars movie right before Burning

[16:58] Man,

[17:00] As you should.

[17:01] Yeah, exactly. But I, it's again, that's also in the

[17:05] consciousness. It's the concept of the warrior monk. It's the

[17:09] concept of the Jedi, right? And the return and the

[17:13] reconciliation. And now we're in the stage of mastery of the two

[17:16] worlds. The split that Dolores Cannon was referring to that was

[17:22] coming the split in the earth the two earths. It's a

[17:25] relational also to the concept of the two worlds mastery of the

[17:29] two worlds. It's being able to unite heaven and spirituality,

[17:34] or heaven spirituality and the earth plane in manifestation.

[17:38] It's the return.

[17:39] So that is, but that is what I've heard from many people I've

[17:43] spoken to. Is that other other civilizations, maybe around the

[17:49] universe, through channelings and through even esoteric

[17:54] writings, are they are able to do exactly that. They it's like

[17:58] a like hybrid between they're not fully in spirit, but they're

[18:01] not fully here. This is a very dense reality where a more

[18:04] evolved civilization, they have to have the telekinesis, being

[18:09] able to talk telepathically, these kind of things. These are

[18:12] ideas that've been around for centuries, and that is kind of

[18:16] where we're supposed to supposedly going in this cycle.

[18:20] In the yugas right now we're on our upward swing right now past

[18:23] the dark ages and now we're going towards the age of

[18:26] enlightenment which is going to take a minute but this is a very

[18:30] pivotal these next 50 years it's very pivotal for humanity

[18:34] Oh without a doubt so but you asked the question you know why

[18:37] is this coming up now I believe it's the exact same reason that

[18:41] I've just said. Why Enoch? Enoch is just this archetypal story of

[18:47] the city that he basically was responsible for. Translated, it

[18:52] went up into heaven. He walked with God, and in the you know

[18:57] Kabbalistic tradition, they have this concept of Metatron. The

[19:03] Greek pronunciation of it is Metron, and is supposed to be

[19:07] this like angel who's into sacred geometry, and that's what

[19:14] Enoch was. Enoch was very much into the geometry. He's

[19:17] explaining the geometry of the calendar and the precision of

[19:22] it.

[19:22] So the Book of Enoch is not does not come from Judaism. It does

[19:26] not come from the Torah, or does it?

[19:28] It would be. It would also be kind of considered the

[19:31] non-canonical. It's it's books that are recognized as being

[19:35] sacred scripture, but they're not part

[19:37] Of the canon.

[19:38] They're not part of the five books of the Torah. The five

[19:41] books of the Torah, right, are you know Genesis, Numbers,

[19:45] Deuteronomy, Leviticus, Exodus, right. Those are the books of

[19:50] the of that we know of as the five books that were written by

[19:52] Moses. So what we think of as the Torah is all predominantly

[19:56] the books of Moses. These are all the books of Moses. These

[19:59] are non canonical. Books that are studied, and rabbis study

[20:03] them, and they they definitely know about this concept of

[20:06] Metatron for sure, and they believe that it's directly

[20:10] associated with Enoch,

[20:11] And that and the

[20:12] Enoch becomes an angel, and it's all matching exactly my work too

[20:16] on the Giza plateau. So you know that the the Giza pyramids are

[20:21] all the three belt stars, the three belt stars, and we see

[20:24] this everywhere. I'm going to Tevativakan in a few weeks, and

[20:28] there's three belt star formation there as well. And and

[20:31] you can't say that they're totally separate because the

[20:34] height of the pyramid called Katmankari, which is the third

[20:38] pyramid on on Giza Plateau, is 216 feet. The height of the

[20:42] Pyramid of the Sun in Tewa Tibakan 216 feet. The base is

[20:46] 756 feet for both the Pyramid of the Sun and the Great Pyramid of

[20:51] Giza. Pyramid of the Sun in Teotihuacan, totally separated

[20:55] places. And then the base width of the Pyramid of the Moon in

[21:00] Teotihuacan is the exact same height as the Great Pyramid, so

[21:03] you could say that they split up Minkari Pyramid and the Great

[21:07] Pyramid, and they spread it across these three pyramids and

[21:12] their portions. How did that happen?

[21:15] It's it's it's obviously a coincidence.

[21:17] Yeah, it's a pretty incredible coincidence, right? So so

[21:21] So there are other so, so there are other books though, Robert,

[21:25] like the Gospel of Mary Magdalene, and there are other

[21:30] Gospel of Thomas,

[21:31] Gospel, yeah, Gospel of Thomas. So there are other books that

[21:35] just were just taken out, but still survived somehow.

[21:38] Yes, they're they're referred to as the apocryphal, as the

[21:41] apocryphal texts by some, or also referred to as the

[21:45] apocrypha.

[21:46] All right. So then,

[21:47] So so why I mention this though is is we think of the Giza

[21:52] Plateau as related to these three belt stars of Orion. But

[21:56] what if I told you there's another constellation that

[21:59] actually matches potentially even better at the association

[22:03] of those three stars and the way the pyramids align, and that

[22:08] other constellation is called the Swan. It's Cygnus. Now

[22:13] Cygnus is across the sky, and the Swan has white wings that

[22:17] look like angelic wings. What I found is that I found two new

[22:20] pyramids on the Giza Plateau that are southwest of Minkari

[22:23] Pyramid, and those two new pyramids are matching exactly

[22:27] the maps from four different cartographers from the 15th,

[22:32] 16th, and 18th centuries. They never talk to each other. Those

[22:37] pyramid placements are matching the star locations when you put

[22:41] and overlay the Cygnus constellation on top of the

[22:44] three pyramids, they match perfectly. And then there's two

[22:47] other locations of stars called Omicron Cygni and and Zeta

[22:53] Cygni. Those two star locations are matched exactly where the

[22:57] two other pyramids are. So it means those have now become the

[23:01] wings because it's on the swan. These are the wings. The three

[23:05] stars are right. The body, but then it starts to go out to the

[23:07] wings of the swan. What it's basically telling us is that in

[23:12] the story of Osiris, Osiris loses his his his ability

[23:17] because he gets killed. Right, he dies and he ends up getting

[23:20] reincarnated as Horus. Horus takes on the battle with Set,

[23:23] and Set plucks out his left eye-the left eye of intuition,

[23:26] the feminine. Okay, our calendar system: we have a 365.24 day

[23:33] calendar for the solar cycle. We have a 354.6 day lunar cycle.

[23:41] Now, if you average those two together, they're exactly 360

[23:44] days. Now, how did that happen? The reason that happened is that

[23:49] we forgot to include the feminine aspect in our calendar

[23:53] system. That's really what's happened, right? And the

[23:57] Egyptians and the Mesopotamians-they all use

[24:00] 360-day calendars. So this was kind of known, but we somehow

[24:04] lost it. We lost it. So what happens is that the story of the

[24:09] hero's journey is that Horus, which is really Enoch, Osiris,

[24:14] right? It's really the same folks over and over and over

[24:17] again. Has to get back the eye of Horus, the left eye of Horus,

[24:22] to awaken the third eye of Thoth, the third eye in the

[24:26] center of the forehead, the third eye of Thoth is this

[24:31] combination of warrior and monk. It's the ability to hold

[24:36] multivariate opposing viewpoints and be able to do so in

[24:41] equanimity and without judgment, and it's the ability to have

[24:44] pure intuition that's next level beyond. The other name for this

[24:49] is called the Eye of Shiva. Shiva constellation is also

[24:53] Orion. So what has to happen? The story is is that Orion has

[24:57] to ascend, and as Orion ascends, he. Gets back the eye of Horus.

[25:02] He gets back the eye of the feminine. He awakens the third

[25:05] eye of Shiva, and as the third eye of Shiva is awakened, the

[25:09] swan descends upon him. So Orion has to make the traversal across

[25:14] the entire northern sky to get the descension of the swan

[25:19] that's flying down upon him, and it gives him his wings. So when

[25:23] you place the wings on top of those three pyramids, all of a

[25:28] sudden now you've got Orion and Osiris and the Vitruvian Man

[25:33] getting his wings. It's literally getting the angelic

[25:37] wings back. It's about opening the eye of Horus, that then

[25:41] leads to the opening of the Eye of Shiva, the Eye of Thoth, as

[25:44] it's also called. And Shiva is not only a name that showed up

[25:48] in you know the the eastern region of the world in India and

[25:52] in China, et cetera. It shows up as Siwa in Egypt. Siwa is a

[25:58] place of induction. It's a place of initiation. I'm going to go

[26:01] there on a trip next year. So the the point is that this is

[26:05] the story, and it's the story of Enoch transcending. And is there

[26:10] some sort of big cataclysm coming? Maybe in one of the

[26:13] versions of Earth. I think that's why the Noah's Ark thing

[26:16] is coming up.

[26:17] Yeah, because I think also, but could it be a if there is a

[26:22] cataclysm, it might not be a physical one, though it might be

[26:27] more of a spiritual one. Does that make any sense? Something

[26:31] happened that could just set everything off in a way that

[26:34] awakens mass. I say mass awakening, and I'm saying the

[26:38] entire planet will waken up at the same time. It'll go in

[26:40] stages, but something happens. You know, is it disclosure, like

[26:44] actual, you know, contact? Is it, you know, a great discovery

[26:49] like Noah, and everyone just starts saying, or something else

[26:52] that they discover, like, hey, here's Jesus wrote this book. We

[26:56] just found it. He actually wrote something down. Look, and we

[27:00] could believe it in the yeah totally right. He he wrote some

[27:03] stuff down so on some post its, you know, kind of thing. It

[27:08] could be something like that because I I'm hoping, but I this

[27:12] is I'm I'm on the fence really on this Robert because I don't

[27:15] think there's going to be a giant cataclysm that will wipe

[27:18] out the planet or anything like that. But I do think that

[27:20] there's going to be stages of things that there'll be

[27:22] collapses, and we're seeing it already collapses in.

[27:25] Oh, I mean that is for sure. I mean we're already seeing the

[27:28] collapse of what we know of as civilization right now.

[27:31] It start. It's slow. It's slow. Well, just like in Rome, Rome

[27:35] didn't fall in a day. It took a while.

[27:37] No, that's right. It takes takes a while. It definitely takes a

[27:40] while for it to fall apart, but it's, it's. I would say it's

[27:44] it's moving pretty fast right now.

[27:46] God, it it is, isn't it?

[27:48] It's super fast. I mean, it's like a breakneck pace. Even for

[27:51] me, I have a hard time because, like you, I grew up in the same

[27:53] time frame. I liked the same movies. I had kind of an idyllic

[27:56] childhood, and the world was good to me. I. It's not like I

[28:00] had a bad life in the old world. I didn't have a bad life. I had

[28:03] a good life. I was successful. You know, it worked for me. I'm

[28:07] one of the people that maybe the old world worked for. But yeah,

[28:11] I think what's happening now is the realization that what we

[28:17] thought was the objective truth was never truly an objective

[28:23] fact or truth. It was merely a facet. It's not a fact. It's a

[28:28] facet of a larger prism of truth. And now we have to

[28:32] realize that the way that we had been seeing the world in this

[28:37] unipolar viewpoint was really just the way that we believed we

[28:41] thought would benefit us the most, because we're unwilling to

[28:47] see anything else. Now, I've never had. Have you ever had an

[28:50] objective experience?

[28:52] What do you mean by an objective experience? Can you define that?

[28:55] Where it's undeniable that your experience was be identical to

[28:59] anyone else having the exact same experience, and how you

[29:01] would describe it after the fact.

[29:03] Sure,

[29:04] Give me an example of what

[29:05] An objective experience. I mean, well, it's it's everyone is it's

[29:10] going to have a different perspective because everyone's

[29:11] filter is different and everyone's life experience is

[29:13] different. So I could eat a burger and go, "That's the best

[29:16] burger I ever had, and somebody else could eat the burger and

[29:17] go, "That is dog crap. So it's so you're right. No, I have not

[29:21] had that. I've had something that I've eaten similar things,

[29:24] or I've seen similar things, or I've been in similar things, and

[29:26] experienced similar things. But everyone's filter and baggage

[29:30] that they bring along in their soul's journey is going to, you

[29:34] know, taint it. So no, it's impossible. Exactly.

[29:37] Okay. So then, how do we have science?

[29:39] Science is something that you can prove and quote unquote

[29:45] prove, recreate, test, experiment, and then the same

[29:50] thing happens again and again and again. No matter how many

[29:53] times you try it, and it's just proof. Like, well, that's

[29:56] actually just the way that works because I can prove it again and

[29:59] again and again and again. So one plus one is two. One plus

[30:02] one is two. No matter what you do, one plus one is two.

[30:04] Generally speaking, there there is some one plus one equals a,

[30:08] but that's a whole other conversation.

[30:10] So generally saying then, so I think what you're actually

[30:12] saying is that the experience might actually be the same. Like

[30:17] you and I could eat the burger, sure. But the meaning that we

[30:20] ascribe to that experience is entirely subjective,

[30:24] Completely.

[30:26] Right, and so that's the ontology that we're basically

[30:29] attaching to it. Ontology is a study of meaning, right? It's

[30:33] the meaning. So you could say one plus one is two, but what

[30:36] does that actually mean? A math with no meaning is just

[30:38] information, but math with meaning can become divine

[30:41] communication.

[30:42] Correct.

[30:42] How you attach meaning to your experience is what we're all

[30:45] actually doing. Maybe that's what we actually call space

[30:48] time. So the point is that these stories that we have, from the

[30:52] Ramayana to Odyssey to the hero's journey, and it wasn't

[30:57] created by by Joseph Campbell. It was found by Joseph Campbell,

[31:02] Synthesized or

[31:04] It was synthesized. He took 1000s and 1000s of stories

[31:08] throughout human history and looked at the common

[31:11] denominators, and they were all the same storyline. And movie

[31:15] makers have learned to master this because if you don't,

[31:18] you're not going to have a great movie. You look at Lord of

[31:22] Rings. You look at you said the the perfect example of it is

[31:24] Star Wars. Star Wars is a great example of it. It's it's

[31:28] literally the battle, right? And and every detail in between. So

[31:33] this this whole concept is, I think, what's coming into the

[31:36] consciousness right now that your experience, whether you

[31:40] like it or not, has entirely been for your entire life

[31:44] subjective. It's not objective because any meaning you ascribe

[31:49] to that experience has been entirely painted by your own

[31:52] subjectivity,

[31:53] Your own life and life experience. Of course.

[31:56] So that's why this is coming up. Now, do I think there's going to

[31:59] be a cataclysm? I don't know. I can't tell you that. I can't say

[32:03] one way or another. I believe that I believe that what Dolores

[32:07] Cannon says is right. I believe there's going to be two

[32:09] existences: people that go more into judgment and people that go

[32:13] more into non-judgment. And this realization that there are

[32:18] multiple ways of seeing the world and ascribing meaning to

[32:21] it, and that each of those is entirely subjective. That's what

[32:27] I believe.

[32:27] That's where we're going,

[32:30] And I believe that's where we're going.

[32:32] Yeah, I don't disagree with you. I think that I think there is.

[32:35] I've been hearing that from many people I've spoken to, and my

[32:39] own research is that these that the the two Earths that the the

[32:42] two existence that there's going to be a group of us that will

[32:46] decide to live in another timeline quote unquote another

[32:50] timeline and another group can live elsewhere and that happens

[32:53] right now you and I are having a very you know beautiful

[32:57] conversation peaceful conversation about this now

[33:00] other people it's fast all you gotta do is look at the comments

[33:03] of this conversation. When this comes out, just look at the

[33:05] comments, and some people will say this is the greatest thing

[33:08] I've ever seen in my life.

[33:10] Yes, and some people are gonna be like, "This is total.

[33:12] This is all BS. This is this is absolute heresy. I can't believe

[33:16] you're talking about this. This is the only way. So you just,

[33:20] I've kind of like look when I look at comments now. I'm like,

[33:22] oh, this is this is their filter. This is their story that

[33:26] they're holding on to, regardless of it. Because we

[33:28] could look at the exact same conversation. It's fascinating

[33:31] to see that some people are like, I don't like Robert's

[33:33] shirt. I don't like the way he's sitting right now. Why did he

[33:36] bring that bow out? That's violent. Like, there's 1000

[33:39] stupid things that people can say. You know what I mean, and

[33:43] other people were like, "Oh my God, how cool is that? He was

[33:45] talking about the so it's all it's absolutely subjective,

[33:49] completely, and has little to do with you and me. That I realize

[33:52] it has really little to do with you and me because they don't

[33:54] know us personally. So that's an example of the subjective aspect

[34:00] of the work that we're doing, but also the subjective factor

[34:03] of everything that we interact with as humanity. I can look at

[34:08] the Book of Enoch. You can look at the Book of Enoch and

[34:10] interpret it two different ways. I'd argue that both you and I

[34:13] will probably be similar camps in the way that we look at it.

[34:16] Other people will look. This is heresy. This is not part of the

[34:19] original canon, and the original canon is like the word of God,

[34:22] you know what I mean, and they get caught up in all this kind

[34:24] of stuff. So it's fascinating to me.

[34:26] To me, I do find that the timing of all this is very interesting,

[34:29] though, because I look at the world. I'm a student of

[34:32] observation. I look at around me, yeah, see what things are in

[34:36] the awareness, because it's not a universe to me; it's a

[34:39] universe. So the story of Enoch is that is a man who walks with

[34:44] God who becomes you know he's also referred to as the only you

[34:47] know he's he's he's like literally like a perfect man,

[34:52] and he ends up ascending and bringing his whole city with

[34:55] him, the city of Enoch. And is it coincidence that Enoch Eno?

[35:02] Is you know like in in Hebrew everything has to end with like

[35:08] it's kind of like got it's all only consonants. There's no

[35:11] vowels in the language. There's no vowels written in the

[35:14] language, right? So you've got yod hey vav hey that that's

[35:19] that's way. It's like a breath. Well, when you think about this

[35:26] as well, it's like okay, we had to put into the words the

[35:30] vowels, so it's only consonants we put in the words. So if you

[35:34] have a word like Eno, how would it end? Eno, I laugh because I'm

[35:38] like, wait, that's like the one backwards, eno backwards. the

[35:43] one backwards. It's like an anagram,

[35:46] Or or like Neo,

[35:47] Like Neo exactly.

[35:51] One Trinity Morpheus. I mean, let's not get into it. We should

[35:55] do a whole episode just

[35:58] Rabbit hole right there.

[35:59] We should we should absolutely do an episode just on the

[36:01] Matrix.

[36:02] So here's the backdrop, right? We've got we've got Enoch, who's

[36:06] supposed to be this grandfather of Noah. It's the time of the

[36:08] flood. His city somehow translates, goes to a different

[36:14] existence. Maybe they choose a different timeline to

[36:19] experience. They get called up into heaven, into this

[36:22] ascension. It seems kind of like an interesting parallel of what

[36:26] we're talking about now.

[36:27] Let's dive into the Book of Enoch for a second, even deeper.

[36:30] There's these this concept of the Watchers. Can you explain to

[36:33] people what the Watchers are? Because, you know, I think Stan

[36:38] Lee took it took it straight from the Book of Enoch for

[36:41] Marvel, because in Marvel there are the Watchers, and there is

[36:45] one called the Watcher who watches over our reality, and

[36:49] it's like this being that just watches everything and doesn't

[36:53] interfere, but can kind of like whisper and guide people, but

[36:57] generally just observe unless. And if things get out of hand,

[37:00] they step in.

[37:01] They have a prime directive like Star Trek.

[37:03] It's a prime directive exactly. It's a prime directive. So who

[37:07] are the Watchers in the Book of Enoch?

[37:09] So it's interesting because, gosh, there's so many

[37:12] interpretations of this, and I'm only going to give you what I

[37:15] believe they are. Okay, so I'm not trying to make a claim. I'm

[37:18] not Wes Huff is going to basically try to say whatever

[37:21] and just throw it out and see what spaghetti sticks to the

[37:24] wall. No, I'm going to tell you, I'm a student of this first and

[37:27] foremost. I want to understand it better, but I also feel like

[37:31] the more I learn, the less I know. So that's my caveat. That

[37:35] clear? Fair enough. So in the in the story, you have angels that

[37:42] were supposed to come from higher dimension that came down

[37:45] to earth, right? These angels were listed and they're named in

[37:49] the Book of Enoch as well. So you can see the names of them,

[37:52] and some of them sound like really almost like evil-sounding

[37:55] names, like Azazel, right? They've got all kinds of bizarre

[37:58] names. Interestingly, the name Metatron is not listed, and

[38:03] Metatron is supposed to be an archangel that's supposed to be

[38:06] at the level of, if not higher than even, is also referred to

[38:09] by Kabbalistic rabbis as the as the little Yahweh, the little

[38:14] Yahweh, okay, or the lesser Yahweh, is the correct way to

[38:18] say that. So it's notably missing, and then you've got

[38:22] Mikhail, and you've got all of the other Raphael and Gabriel.

[38:26] They're all basically listed on this. The Watchers in this

[38:30] context; these these angels come down to Earth. They're supposed

[38:34] to, I guess, just supposed to watch over the place, right? And

[38:38] yet somehow they kind of come into it. They're like, "Hey,

[38:42] let's look look at the comely daughters of the of the children

[38:45] of men, and the comely daughters of the children of men all of a

[38:49] sudden are these beautiful women, and we saw that they are

[38:52] beautiful, and so one of them decides one day, let's start

[38:55] mating with them as angels, and that creates the giants,

[38:59] supposedly described as red-haired, you know, giants

[39:02] that basically wreak havoc on the land, multiple rows of teeth

[39:06] and all this stuff. So these were sort of angels that were

[39:11] supposed to have been good, but somehow come down into this

[39:14] dimension and get defiled,

[39:16] Corrupt. Yeah, corrupted.

[39:18] Corrupted, right? They get corrupted. They teach the things

[39:22] that they're not supposed to teach, is how it describes it as

[39:24] well. They do the stuff that they're not supposed to do. They

[39:27] teach the stuff. They have sex with the women. They're not

[39:29] supposed to do that, and this is like evil and bad. This is part

[39:33] of the reason why the flood had to come to wipe it all out to

[39:36] cleanse the whole thing. Yeah.

[39:39] So it wasn't. It wasn't. So the flood didn't come to wipe away

[39:43] man's sins; it came to deal with this issue.

[39:47] Also, this issue, yes, it doesn't say it was only this

[39:51] issue, but this was one of the things it lists that needed to

[39:54] be basically fixed. Okay, so that's what I'm saying. It does.

[39:58] It does conspicuously tie. To this Noah's Ark showing up right

[40:03] now. That's how I see this. And so basically, these these

[40:07] watchers were entrusted with this responsibility, and somehow

[40:12] they're teaching people astrology. They're teaching

[40:14] people magic incantations, right? They're teaching people

[40:19] science and the knowledge of wisdom of God. Now, why would

[40:24] they do that? Why would they do that?

[40:28] Bored? I mean, why?

[40:32] Maybe they're just. I mean, there isn't. There's an argument

[40:35] that says maybe that's because that's what they were supposed

[40:38] to do. Now, think about this for a moment. I remember when I went

[40:46] to-I used to be Mormon. I'm not Mormon anymore, but in the

[40:51] Mormon temple, they have something that is taken from the

[40:56] Freemason rites, and it's the temple ceremony. So I was lucky

[41:03] because I guess I got to learn the temple ceremony of

[41:06] Freemasonry by virtue of the fact that I was Mormon, even

[41:09] though I never learned, I never was a Freemason, because it's a

[41:13] very similar system. Now some say that part of the reason why

[41:17] the Freemasons got, you know, why Joseph Smith got murdered in

[41:20] the end was because he defiled and broke the covenant of not

[41:25] you know that's supposed to be confidential. You're not

[41:27] supposed to share that information with anyone, and yet

[41:30] and yet he did and made it put it into the temple endowment. So

[41:34] in the in the temple endowment, there's one philosophy, and it

[41:37] actually has this whole thing. I'm not divulging anything

[41:41] really terribly confidential here? But they reenact the whole

[41:45] beginning of the Garden of Eden in the Mormon Temple rite. So in

[41:51] the Mormon temple rite, they have a reenactment of the Garden

[41:53] of Eden, and there is Adam, and there is Eve, and they have

[41:58] little fig leaves, and this is why they have aprons also in

[42:00] Freemasonry, same thing. It's kind of representing. Oh, why

[42:03] was God shows up and says, Adam, what are you doing? Oh, where

[42:06] were you? I was I was hiding. Why were you hiding? Because I

[42:09] was ashamed. Why were you ashamed? Because I was naked.

[42:11] Who told you you're naked? Did you eat of the fruit of the tree

[42:14] of knowledge of good and evil? I told you not to. Yeah, and I

[42:17] told you the day you do it is the day thou shalt surely die.

[42:20] Yeah, the woman that you gave me-that he gave it me the fruit,

[42:26] and I ate it. Eve, what did you do? The serpent beguiled me, and

[42:30] I did eat. Now there is a philosophy that says even the

[42:34] act of Lucifer, basically tempting Eve to give her the

[42:41] fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, and that's

[42:42] what the description is. Is that Lucifer is then described as a

[42:45] snake that will have the power to to to bruise your heel, but

[42:51] mankind will have the power to crush your head. Is the

[42:53] description in the Bible?

[42:55] Hold on one second. I wanted to I wanted to touch on something

[42:57] that that I haven't really dived into before. The Old Testament

[43:01] of the Bible is essentially the Torah, correct?

[43:05] Yeah, it's Genesis. That's the what you're thinking of right

[43:07] now is Genesis,

[43:08] Correct! Yes, it's the Torah. So it's it's yes comes from

[43:12] Judaism. Okay, to my understanding, the concept of

[43:17] the devil and Lucifer wasn't that a new? And please correct

[43:23] me. It wasn't that. It wasn't New Testament. It was all Old

[43:26] Testament, because there's no hell according to the Jewish

[43:30] tradition. There is no hell. It just goes into something. So who

[43:33] is the snake? And is it if it is the devil? Then where else is

[43:37] the devil as a character in the first Old Testament, or was that

[43:40] just added in the Christian Bible versus the Torah?

[43:44] No, I mean, look. Here is the thing: is that how Judaism sees

[43:48] it is just based on their ontology that they described

[43:52] related to it. So even though the the events might be the

[43:55] same, and by the way, that's why we have Islam. Islam also

[43:58] believes in the Book of Genesis, right? They just have their own

[44:02] interpretation of it. It's like Abraham screwed up, right? He

[44:07] had a bad estate plan. He had one child. It was his first

[44:10] child was Ishmael to this, you know, this housemaid that he had

[44:14] in the house, which was Hagar, and then Sarah couldn't get

[44:18] pregnant until she's 90 years old. Then she finally gets

[44:20] pregnant, and they're like, okay, sorry, Ismael, you got to

[44:22] get out of here. So they go to Mecca, and where does Abraham

[44:26] go? Abraham's in Haran, and then he goes, you know, to the

[44:30] Promised Land. He goes towards the Promised Land, land of

[44:32] Canaan. The point is that it's just interpretation. Who was the

[44:38] first birthright holder? Ishmael is the oldest son, but it's

[44:41] Isaac who gets the land in the blessing of Abraham. So, and

[44:46] both sides have their own version of this. So that's

[44:49] that's the point. Is yes, you could say, well, wait. There's a

[44:51] devil. There's a Lucifer described in the Old Testament.

[44:54] There is most definitely, and the serpent beguiles. And who is

[44:58] a serpent? Well. That's Lucifer. Who is Lucifer? Well, you have

[45:03] to go to Paradise Lost.

[45:06] Well, yeah. Now, but now we're not in biblical times. Now we're

[45:08] in.

[45:09] Now that goes to the interpretation of what's written

[45:12] about the story of the serpent. So the story of the serpent

[45:14] becomes Lucifer is the light bringer. In the pre-war of

[45:18] heaven, there were a third of the host of heaven taken away,

[45:22] according to this, right? This is the Milton story, and they

[45:26] get taken away and they follow Lucifer.

[45:28] That's Milton, right? Yeah,

[45:29] And they come to Earth to torment the children of men. And

[45:33] the reason why they broke off is because Lucifer had his own plan

[45:37] about how mankind was going to live its days, and instead of

[45:40] having to go through this process and have a salvation,

[45:44] make mistakes and learn through suffering and everything, he

[45:47] proposes a different plan, which is, "I'll make sure everyone

[45:49] gets there to heaven in the end. And this angers God the Father,

[45:53] and God the Father says, "No. And Jesus steps forward and

[45:55] says, "I will sacrifice myself so that there is a savior and

[45:59] there's a salvation. So this whole separation of religion,

[46:03] and and the point is that the question is: Is it part of the

[46:07] matrix of experience that darkness must exist with light?

[46:12] So Dante and Milton were basically the Stephen King and

[46:16] the J.K. Rowling of their day, and then and the church grabbed

[46:21] onto these stories and used them and started not putting them

[46:24] technically in the canon, but preaching about them and talking

[46:27] about them. But the seven levels of hell doesn't exist in the

[46:29] Bible. No, neither does neither do the demons and the pitchforks

[46:33] and the lakes of fire and all that. It's different, like the

[46:36] lake of fire with what Christ talked about, was Hannah

[46:38] Gehenna, which is different and all that, but that's all that

[46:41] imagery that they eventually used for their, and I'm calling

[46:45] it what it is: propaganda and the great paintings of Europe

[46:49] and all the art pieces. That's all that stuff, and that's

[46:52] around the 1300s, around the 13th century. So they just took

[46:57] that and grabbed it. So that doesn't exist in the original

[46:59] canon. No, I say I say all of this because I want people

[47:03] listening who have a problem maybe with what we're having a

[47:06] conversation about. It's like the book is not like oh this is

[47:09] the book and nothing has changed, no one has touched it,

[47:11] everything was perfect. I mean Jesus spoke spoke Arabic. He did

[47:16] not speak Greek or Latin, which is what the first Bibles were.

[47:20] The first, if I'm not mistaken, right? The first Bible was

[47:23] written in Greek and then translated into Latin. You know,

[47:27] eventually, correct.

[47:28] It was written in the original Greek, but Aramaic was his

[47:30] language,

[47:32] Right! And he never wrote anything down. So all of this is

[47:34] stories handed down from story after story, and then switched

[47:38] around in the King James Bible, and then Dante. Like it's just

[47:41] all this hodgepodge of stuff. Before I let you go, because I

[47:46] know you're a very busy world traveler, so you are easily the

[47:48] most interesting man in the world. You mentioned something

[47:52] in regards to the flood, which I wanted to touch upon. If they

[47:56] found Noah's Ark now, is that because, from what I understand,

[48:03] and this is my interpretation of of the information, a lot of the

[48:06] stuff we're talking about with the the the Nelefim and the

[48:10] Watchers, Nephilimia and the Watchers and all that stuff that

[48:15] happened more than 12,000 years ago, more than 10,000 years ago,

[48:19] in my understanding. And please correct me if I'm wrong, because

[48:22] if we look at the geological evidence of there was a

[48:27] catastrophic event that was around the time of Atlantis, and

[48:33] and then there was the the melting of the ice caps and all

[48:36] of that stuff and the great flood and every every culture on

[48:38] the planet has a great flood story. How does Noah's Ark at

[48:45] this point match with that timeline, or is this Noah's Ark

[48:49] been there, hidden, protected, and sealed, just like Pompeii,

[48:55] for centuries upon centuries upon centuries? I just wanted to

[48:58] see how that. What you think?

[48:59] We don't know, and and right now the carbon dating is also, you

[49:04] know, there's a whole theory that says that if you have any

[49:08] radioactivity at the surface, that it can have a big impact on

[49:11] carbon dating timelines, and so I just watched a whole episode

[49:16] related to that recently, and basically they don't know how

[49:21] old these the Noah's Ark thing is. Hopefully, they're going to

[49:24] be able to find out. There are some that are saying they

[49:26] believe it's like 4000, maybe 5000 years old, but I think it's

[49:30] got to be far older than that. It has to be far older than

[49:33] that. And how does a how does a boat like that end up on a

[49:36] mountain top at 6500 feet? That's pretty high, and preserve

[49:41] up here. Yeah, it's relatively preserved, and yeah, it looks

[49:45] like it's somewhat you know kind of almost petrified or

[49:48] something. But you can see it, and you can see this is clearly

[49:51] it's a boat. It's definitely a boat. Now that starts to raise

[49:55] all kinds of questions about like what is the true history of

[49:58] the world, right? We. As we all thought that these Bible stories

[50:02] are just sort of fairy tales. Where did all the water come

[50:05] from for it to have gotten that high up? How big of a flood was

[50:08] this? And where is the water? Is the water from inside the earth,

[50:12] and then it subsides? It comes out. You know, maybe there's a

[50:16] pole shift or something, and and and you have a crustal

[50:19] displacement. We don't know. Is this just part of the cycle of

[50:22] time? Our history. Here's the problem. Our history has an

[50:27] abrupt beginning 6000 years ago. We don't have anything beyond

[50:31] 6000 years.

[50:33] Well, I mean, isn't

[50:35] Besides Göbekli Tepe, Gebekli Tepe, Carahantepi, the stuff in

[50:39] Turkey, which, by the way, this is around the same area as where

[50:42] this Noah's Ark supposedly is found, but in general, when you

[50:46] go back to mainstream science, they'll tell you that we don't

[50:49] really have any mainstream historical records of anything

[50:53] that goes beyond 6000 years. So, what is this? It starts to

[50:59] really raise major questions about what is the history of

[51:02] humanity, what is the true story, and I think everybody

[51:06] knows that there's something that doesn't quite fit. The

[51:09] story doesn't foot, and we all feel this. Was there an

[51:13] Atlantis? We have only one reference from you know the

[51:16] Critias and from Timaeus by Plato, where he talks about

[51:18] Solon, who was you know generations before him who

[51:22] basically says yeah this is what Atlantis was but it was 9000

[51:25] years before the day of Plato which was the fourth century BC

[51:30] So now you start to go what is the story here and and that's my

[51:35] point is that I believe that all of this is coming up for a

[51:40] reason it's going to make some sort of big, almost cinematic

[51:45] debut for everyone. It's going to be tied together with you

[51:50] know look at all the things converging right now. Is it a

[51:52] coincidence that mankind is making AI, which is essentially

[51:57] like a digital golem, right? A clay man, just like the

[52:01] rabbinical, you know, priests when they go through their

[52:04] process, they start to make a clay man. So you make the clay

[52:10] man, and at the same time, it's actually representation of you

[52:13] emulating the active creation of man. That's what we're also kind

[52:17] of doing collectively, and is it happening as a coincidence at

[52:20] the same time as our global awakening, you have a wake on

[52:24] this picture right over your shoulder. Is that just a

[52:28] coincidence? Is it a coincidence that this is happening right now

[52:31] also, and we finally, after 1000s of years of not knowing if

[52:34] it's true or not, now finding out that possibly the story of

[52:37] Noah's Ark might actually be true? I don't think this is all

[52:42] coincidence. I used to believe in coincidence. I don't believe

[52:45] in coincidence anymore.

[52:47] Well, look at what happened with Troy. They thought that was a

[52:49] myth, and they actually found the city of Troy.

[52:51] That's right. So I mean, I think we're on the precipice again.

[52:56] I'm not claiming that I know everything, and I can only give

[52:59] you my own interpretations of what I believe I'm reading when

[53:04] I read these things. I listened to the audio book of of this

[53:08] whole story of the Watchers and of the Book of Enoch like six

[53:12] times last week. I never listened to something six times

[53:15] in the same week. So the reason I did is because there are so

[53:19] many aspects of it that I'm trying to piece together was

[53:23] this literally at the same time concomitant with Noah and the

[53:27] flood. Was there this group that translated? What caused them to

[53:30] be translated? I want more details about that.

[53:33] The logic behind Noah's Ark, I I don't disbelieve that there is a

[53:37] boat that did something, but I don't believe in the concept of

[53:42] like putting in every animal from the planet, two of

[53:45] everything. That doesn't make any logical sense. The lions

[53:49] would have had a field day, you know. I'm sure it wasn't that

[53:52] organized where the predators were away from the the food and

[53:56] so on and so forth. So that doesn't make sense. But the idea

[53:59] of the concept of a Noah's Ark, that there might have been

[54:01] something to save people, to save things, absolutely. But I

[54:05] think the the typical.

[54:07] Here's the thing: if it's true and the dimensions seem to

[54:11] match, right stories and the three stories inside the boat

[54:15] were basically to house all these animals. It wasn't to

[54:17] house other family members. They know all the family members. I

[54:20] mean, you have basically the the three sons. It was Ham, right?

[54:23] Hem, Japheth, right? And Seth. Those are the three sons of

[54:28] Noah. That's it. There was nobody else on the boat except

[54:31] their their wives. So it's like, why did they need a boat that's

[54:35] like 500, you know, plus feet long, 550 feet long? Why?

[54:40] So so then maybe to maybe once they actually open it up, like

[54:45] get in there and actually see what's happening, maybe you'll

[54:48] see rows and rows and rows that people could sit in. Who knows?

[54:51] I don't know. I'm just saying that for me, the logic of having

[54:55] so many animals.

[54:57] All I'm going to say to you, my friend, is I am open to. Expect

[55:01] the unexpected.

[55:02] Well, that's that's

[55:03] We're in uncharted territory right now. We're in uncharted

[55:06] territory, and and we're it's like we're we're walking on to

[55:10] Jurassic Park Island for the first time. We don't know the

[55:14] story.

[55:15] We don't.

[55:15] Right. It's like you just hear those dinosaurs out of like,

[55:17] what the hell was that? I mean, that's every day that goes by.

[55:21] I'm like, okay, what's going to happen today? What's next? The

[55:24] world is getting stranger and stranger and stranger. That's

[55:27] the only common denominator in all of this,

[55:30] And it's gotten.

[55:31] And to be well adjusted, I just said this on an interview I did

[55:34] with this UK newspaper. To be well adjusted to an

[55:37] extraordinarily maladjusted world is not a sign of sanity.

[55:41] It should put that on a T-shirt, sir, and sell it. I mean, it is,

[55:45] it's, it's per, it's a really powerful quote, a very honest

[55:49] quote and very true. Robert, it is man. I could, I mean, days

[55:54] and days I can talk to you for. So, I hope I can't wait for you

[55:57] to get back to Austin so you can come back to the studio, sir.

[56:00] Where can people find out more about you and the amazing work

[56:02] you're doing in the world?

[56:04] robertedwardgrant.com and on Instagram, Robert Edward Grant

[56:08] on on all the the platforms. I'm on I'm on all of those, and I do

[56:12] take trips. If you want to go on adventure with me, I'm going to

[56:15] Antarctica in March of 2027. You can find it on my. It's going to

[56:20] be an epic trip, and then I'm going to be in Egypt in

[56:24] November. I'll be in Mexico next week, and and then next year

[56:28] I've got a couple trips to Egypt-one in April and one in

[56:30] August for the Great Eclipse. So, and I'd love to come back at

[56:34] some point and talk to you about the discovery that all of the

[56:37] pyramids around the world are different musical notes, and

[56:40] that together they actually make one song, and that song is the

[56:45] primordial Om chant.

[56:48] Well, that is a good cliffhanger for the next conversation, my

[56:51] friend Robert. I appreciate you, man, and everything you're doing

[56:54] to awaken this planet. And it's always a joy talking to you, my

[56:57] friend. I can't wait to the next time. So, thank you, my friend.

[58:13] Thank you, bro.

NL
Artist
Next Level Soul

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Got Questions?

Frequently Asked Questions

The Book of Enoch is an ancient text that tells of the Watchers, angels who descended to earth and taught humans forbidden knowledge. In this conversation, Robert Edward Grant suggests its renewed interest reflects a wider hunger for older stories that stay with people, much like the Odyssey did for audiences this summer.
The host says the Book of Enoch is included in the Ethiopian version of the Bible, and argues it was physically removed from other canons rather than simply left out. That claim is presented as the host's view and an open question in the episode, not a settled consensus.
The episode raises a reported Noah's Ark discovery and discusses core samples and timing, but it does not present a verified find. The hosts treat the claim as something to evaluate carefully rather than accept.
In the Ramayana, Rama must string the bow of Shiva to prove he is worthy of being king. Grant says Rama breaks the bow, which begins a cycle of loss and reclaimed kingship that he compares to Odysseus stringing his bow in the Odyssey.
Grant argues that Orion appears in nearly every sacred site and that depictions of the figure, holding a club, a fleece, or a bow, reflect the same hero across cultures. He links this to names like Nimrod, though the connection between shared star patterns and a single spiritual narrative is his interpretation rather than established fact.
The Watchers are angels in the Book of Enoch who came to earth and taught esoteric knowledge, and the Nephilim are linked to their descendants in the episode's topic list. Grant connects these figures to flood narratives and to the wider story of human spiritual evolution.

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