Transcript
[0:00] Hi, this is Peter Crone and you're
[0:02] listening to finding freedom. In this
[0:04] episode I get to speak to Alex. [music]
[0:07] And I would assert that this particular
[0:10] topic is something that touches the
[0:12] lives of every human being on the
[0:13] planet. In fact, I would assert
[0:16] the the main limitations that he was
[0:17] struggling with are in the arena of
[0:20] feeling not enough and that perhaps
[0:22] there's fundamentally something wrong
[0:23] with you and I would assert that that is
[0:25] an epidemic
[0:26] that plagues every human being. So if
[0:29] you have at any point in your life
[0:32] felt that perhaps the at the deepest
[0:34] level just being you [music] is not
[0:35] enough,
[0:37] then this episode is for you. As always,
[0:39] it would mean a lot to me if you would
[0:41] like
[0:42] comment and certainly share this with
[0:44] people in your life who you care about,
[0:46] who you love who could benefit from
[0:48] getting beyond [music] the belief
[0:50] that maybe being them is not enough.
[0:53] Sending much love.
[0:55] Alex, my friend, how are we doing?
[0:58] >> Doing really well. Definitely noticing a
[1:00] little bit of nervousness, but also such
[1:03] deep excitement for this conversation.
[1:06] Within all the work that I've done over
[1:08] the past decade, I would say no one has
[1:11] influenced me more than you since I met
[1:13] you six years ago, so this feels like an
[1:16] incredible honor. Thank you for having
[1:17] me.
[1:18] >> Well, thank you for the kind words. What
[1:20] a beautiful way to start. I appreciate
[1:22] it and I'm
[1:24] always touched to know that my work is
[1:27] you know, reaching people out there that
[1:28] I typically don't meet, but here we are
[1:31] together and I'm happy to be with you
[1:32] and do whatever I can
[1:34] expedite whatever learning you've had
[1:36] thus far. So I got your video. I know
[1:39] you said you've been moving a little
[1:40] bit. You born and raised, I think
[1:43] or you were in Canada, you're back in
[1:44] Germany. You said you've sort of had a
[1:46] very tough year. So
[1:48] for the viewing audience, I'd love to
[1:50] just hear what what you've been going
[1:52] through and and what it is that you're
[1:54] looking for help with.
[1:55] >> Yeah. Yeah, so for some context, I was
[1:58] born in Germany. I grew up in immigrant
[2:00] household. So, both my parents are
[2:02] originally from Kazakhstan. We moved to
[2:04] Canada when I was ten, ended up moving
[2:06] back to Germany when I was 17. So, there
[2:09] was a lot of moving around. I myself
[2:11] left Germany when I was 23. Ended up
[2:14] traveling the world, being
[2:17] living in different countries. And for
[2:19] the past five years, I've been living in
[2:21] Bali in Indonesia, where I'm still
[2:23] currently residing.
[2:25] But
[2:26] in the next five weeks, I'm actually
[2:29] going to be moving back to Europe where
[2:31] as well partly I'm going to be based in
[2:34] Europe. And so sorry, in Germany. So,
[2:38] it's going to be a huge big transition
[2:40] for me. And as you'd already shared or
[2:44] alluded to is
[2:45] it's it's definitely been a big year and
[2:48] a lot of shifts,
[2:50] particularly professionally as well.
[2:53] And I see that there's themes
[2:56] around
[2:58] loss of agency and as well powerlessness
[3:02] regularly coming in
[3:04] over the last year. But I would say
[3:06] these have been themes that I've been
[3:08] confronted by, I would say
[3:10] a lot of my life.
[3:12] So, I see that there
[3:14] are there are elements that
[3:17] are seeking perhaps to be integrated, to
[3:19] be recognized, to be met.
[3:22] So,
[3:24] maybe just to finish on this thought
[3:27] where the challenge had been for me over
[3:28] the past year, I'd come out of the best
[3:31] year
[3:33] out of my professional life. I mean,
[3:34] I've been an entrepreneur for the past
[3:36] six years
[3:37] focusing as a coach predominantly in the
[3:40] men's development space, focusing more
[3:42] on masculine integration, embodiment,
[3:46] nervous system work and as well
[3:49] relationship work.
[3:51] And so that's been an incredible time
[3:53] over the past year. But then
[3:56] especially over the last year, things
[3:57] have simply not been coming together.
[4:00] And and a consequence as
[4:02] noticing a lot of heaviness, um
[4:05] perceived sense of failure, a lot of um
[4:08] challenge around that and um
[4:12] [clears throat] internal dialogue that
[4:14] has been as well difficult to
[4:19] I guess be with.
[4:20] And and the last point that I might just
[4:22] make is um I noticed there's a lot of
[4:25] trepidation to me going back to Europe,
[4:28] particularly as well around um just a
[4:30] challenging time I had over there. Um a
[4:33] lot of it um roots back to my family of
[4:36] origins, but also just deep challenges
[4:39] in terms of um my relationship to my
[4:41] peers uh in terms of being bullied in
[4:44] school. Um so I see that a lot of that
[4:47] as well is being activated at the
[4:48] moment. So yeah, a lot here. Um I'll
[4:51] pause here for comment.
[4:53] >> Okay. No, I appreciate the uh
[4:55] the vulnerability and just sharing. So
[4:57] right now just so I'm clear, you're
[4:58] still in Bali, but you're going back to
[5:00] Germany, Europe in 5 weeks?
[5:02] >> Correct.
[5:03] >> Okay. And
[5:05] so I understand your family dynamic. You
[5:08] said your parents were from Kazakhstan,
[5:09] but you're you you were raised in
[5:11] Germany. What's your domicile? Where are
[5:14] you from originally though?
[5:16] >> I was born in Germany. Yeah, so both my
[5:18] parents
[5:18] >> you considered to you German. Okay. But
[5:20] wait, they are your biological parents?
[5:23] >> Yeah, my biological parents. Both both
[5:25] of them met. Both of them So they come
[5:27] from Russian German background. So uh I
[5:30] mean
[5:31] with contacts with when Germany reunited
[5:33] again, they ended up going back to
[5:35] Germany. So um and and they made each
[5:36] other there.
[5:38] >> Okay, got it. Um and then did you have
[5:40] any siblings?
[5:42] >> I have a sister, a younger sister.
[5:44] >> Younger sister and where is she?
[5:46] >> Uh she's in Germany at the moment.
[5:48] >> Okay. And you have a good relationship
[5:50] with her?
[5:53] >> I'll say fairly for sure. There's
[5:55] there's been some distance over the past
[5:57] year, but um in general we've we've had
[6:00] a very strong relationship. Uh there's
[6:02] been definitely some difficult times uh
[6:04] particularly in our teenage years, but
[6:06] had very much found our way as well in
[6:09] over the last decade.
[6:11] She's as well spent a lot of time in
[6:13] Bali and visited me. But we're we're
[6:16] definitely very different in the way we
[6:18] express ourselves, let's just say.
[6:21] >> Okay. What's your relationship like with
[6:23] your parents these days?
[6:25] >> Um well, I would say there's definitely
[6:27] been a lot of work done as it relates to
[6:30] my relationship to my parents.
[6:32] And I would say my general
[6:35] predisposition is a sense of acceptance,
[6:38] but
[6:39] to the limitations and as well the
[6:41] experiences that I've had with them.
[6:44] But simultaneously, obviously there's
[6:45] still wounds that affect me and impact
[6:48] me.
[6:50] I think
[6:51] yeah, just in terms of like speaking to
[6:53] the dynamics that were very strongly
[6:55] present.
[6:58] My my father in general was, you know,
[7:00] very classical, typical, domineering
[7:03] father and
[7:05] in many ways I'd
[7:07] not felt like I could be myself and
[7:10] express myself as I am and it's not okay
[7:13] for me to be who I am
[7:15] in his expression and
[7:20] he he's a carpenter by trade and notices
[7:23] well has a very traditional view of
[7:26] how to be as well as a man. And I I
[7:29] didn't follow that
[7:31] as well in my younger years. And so
[7:34] felt in many ways his sense of criticism
[7:37] and his sense of
[7:41] that I'm not okay as I am.
[7:43] I think that was a really big framing
[7:44] that I received.
[7:46] And
[7:48] in relationship to my mother it's it was
[7:50] rather a bit of a different dynamic.
[7:53] My mother actually went through a very
[7:55] traumatic experience before she met my
[7:57] father.
[7:58] She was already married and she had two
[8:01] children.
[8:02] And she was living in Belarus at the
[8:04] time.
[8:05] And
[8:06] yeah, it's it's something that I've
[8:08] again done a lot of work on and and
[8:09] still
[8:11] I I still feel very strongly at times
[8:14] their house was set on fire and all of
[8:16] them died and she was the only one that
[8:19] survived that experience.
[8:21] >> Wow.
[8:22] >> Yeah.
[8:23] >> Okay. Sorry to hear that.
[8:25] >> Yeah.
[8:26] >> Okay. Um and so are they still in
[8:28] Germany now or where did your parents
[8:30] end up?
[8:32] >> Um yeah they're still in Germany at the
[8:33] moment.
[8:34] >> So when you go home or when you go back
[8:36] do you get your own place will you stay
[8:38] with them for a while like logistically
[8:40] what does it look like?
[8:41] >> Yeah generally I I do travel a lot and
[8:44] as well I'm in other places as well in
[8:46] Europe so when I'm in my hometown I
[8:48] generally stay with them.
[8:50] >> Okay and how old are you now Alex?
[8:53] >> I'm 33.
[8:54] >> 33 okay.
[8:56] So you've obviously done a lot of work
[8:57] you're smart you've you know followed me
[8:59] for five six years. What what would you
[9:01] say I mean you're using language that
[9:04] kind of articulates different
[9:06] perspectives right that that it's not
[9:08] okay for you to be you or it's not
[9:09] enough for you to be you.
[9:11] What would you say are the biggest
[9:13] obstacles that you're aware of that
[9:15] you're up against?
[9:17] Like what is the trepidation about going
[9:19] back to Germany you mentioned you know
[9:21] childhood being bullied
[9:23] but I'm assuming that was
[9:24] you know 20 years ago or there abouts
[9:27] right so
[9:29] you know I I I'm going to guess that
[9:31] you're not going back to being bullied
[9:33] right so it's sort of just the
[9:35] energy of being in the same country
[9:36] maybe in the same town
[9:38] >> Yeah.
[9:39] >> Um but but you're smart enough to know
[9:42] that whatever you went through is what
[9:44] you went through and that really has
[9:46] very little to do with today that
[9:47] doesn't mean that they can't be residual
[9:49] fear that's fine but what what do you
[9:51] think is
[9:53] bugging Alex the most right now?
[9:55] >> Mhm.
[9:58] Well a big challenge for me is
[10:00] professional development and as well
[10:01] finances so I see that
[10:04] within that frame and then some if I
[10:06] just were to zoom out for a moment
[10:08] relative to life I am often in this
[10:11] position that I'm powerless
[10:14] >> Yeah.
[10:14] >> no agency. So I see that is a big
[10:16] framing and
[10:18] you know from an early age as well I I
[10:19] really had to um
[10:23] had
[10:24] installed this belief that it's all up
[10:26] to me. So I see that that a huge framing
[10:29] for me has been that um you know
[10:34] if I really want to create the type of
[10:36] life that I really want to create um
[10:39] I have to figure it out on my own and uh
[10:42] it's it's been difficult as well for me
[10:44] to to rely on others and the moments I
[10:46] have um has as well been met with a
[10:49] certain level of disappointment. So I
[10:52] see that has been definitely something
[10:54] and obviously as well that that there's
[10:55] something wrong with me. I think I think
[10:57] that is as well a really really big one
[10:59] um especially because the bullying
[11:00] wasn't just in Germany it was also in
[11:02] Canada. So it was like you know I didn't
[11:04] just have that one experience but also
[11:06] had you know the follow-up as well once
[11:08] I moved back to Germany. So I was just
[11:10] like
[11:11] okay you know I think I think within
[11:13] that there there's
[11:15] still this installed framing of
[11:19] not taking up as much space as I would
[11:22] like to and um
[11:25] in general in my general predisposition
[11:28] I'm very fiery and as well have a lot to
[11:30] express and a lot to share and bring
[11:32] into the world but I think there can
[11:34] still be this general nervous system
[11:36] predisposition towards hiding or keeping
[11:39] myself smaller to keep myself at bay. Um
[11:43] so I mean I I could go on but I think I
[11:45] think those are some of the more main
[11:47] ones that I see are still installed and
[11:50] somewhat present.
[11:52] >> No I get it. It's beautiful very well
[11:54] articulated. So let's let's look back to
[11:56] when you said your dad being a carpenter
[11:58] more of a traditional masculine figure
[12:00] what were some of the things that little
[12:02] boy remembers
[12:04] being told or or you know having seen
[12:08] that would have framed some of these
[12:10] play small you know something wrong with
[12:12] me
[12:14] Were there any particular memories that
[12:16] stand out as being more dramatic than
[12:18] the others?
[12:20] >> Um, and there's two memories that come
[12:22] into mind. Um, one is more of
[12:26] an ongoing theme that
[12:29] in in moments of conflict I'd I I I
[12:32] think I I've always been very sensitive
[12:34] and very in tune to what is okay and
[12:38] what's not okay based on what I'm
[12:40] noticing and
[12:42] >> Yeah.
[12:42] >> um, I noticed that there was no space
[12:45] for me to express that and there was a
[12:48] natural predisposition of um, you know,
[12:52] listen to what I say and that there's no
[12:54] space for me to express myself and the
[12:57] impact that my father as well as having
[13:00] on me and the moments I would actually
[13:02] speak up I would notice that there would
[13:04] be so much shame that would arise for
[13:06] him because
[13:08] you know, his son is standing up against
[13:10] him um, that he would often
[13:14] uh, withdraw for days and um,
[13:18] there would just be this empty void
[13:21] sometimes even up to a week, you know,
[13:23] when I would actually stand up to him
[13:25] and say hey this is not okay with me.
[13:27] When I would fight against him
[13:30] and I
[13:31] I think a big challenge as well for me
[13:33] had been that the moments
[13:35] that I would stand up and actually
[13:37] express my needs uh, it was those
[13:39] moments where my mom would actually come
[13:41] to me and requested to apologize to my
[13:45] father uh, which I didn't feel like was
[13:49] my
[13:51] I didn't feel like I did anything wrong
[13:53] >> Yeah. [clears throat] Yeah.
[13:55] >> it's almost like I was requested to
[13:56] betray myself and requested to um,
[14:02] keep the peace because you know, when he
[14:04] would withdraw in the ways that he did
[14:06] it impacted the entire family. Um, so
[14:09] that was a really big one.
[14:10] The other one as well is that when
[14:13] things would get very heated and he
[14:15] would get very intense with me.
[14:18] Um,
[14:19] a natural impact of that would be
[14:21] sometimes tears and um I would I would I
[14:25] would cry in front of him and and there
[14:26] was one distinct experience when I was
[14:28] in Canada um that that shook me very
[14:31] deeply um
[14:33] and you know as well
[14:36] you know just want to acknowledge as
[14:37] well before I say what he said uh the
[14:39] impact and
[14:40] um just the inappropriate nature of it
[14:43] but like he
[14:44] referenced me as weaker as my mother
[14:48] um with me being so sensitive and crying
[14:52] and I I recall it was that moment where
[14:54] I just completely shut down for about a
[14:56] decade. I couldn't I couldn't cry and
[14:59] I think there was this installation in
[15:00] myself that I'm weak, pathetic um and I
[15:03] think as well with the subsequent
[15:05] bullying um
[15:07] I think like a big installation has been
[15:09] that I'm a coward.
[15:10] >> Yeah.
[15:12] Okay, got it. Okay.
[15:14] No, beautifully articulate my friend.
[15:15] You're obviously good at what you do in
[15:17] terms of coaching and understanding all
[15:18] these mechanisms. So sometimes
[15:22] um
[15:23] you know I'll I'll jokingly use one of
[15:25] my quotes as say being smart doesn't
[15:28] make you any happier. Just makes your
[15:30] reasons why you're not way more
[15:31] convincing,
[15:33] right? So it's almost like your ability
[15:35] to articulate
[15:36] these different distinctions and
[15:38] different prisons and constraints
[15:40] um
[15:42] can still you know leave you oblivious
[15:45] to your own blind spots, right?
[15:47] But I think you're in the arena. So if
[15:50] you look at your
[15:52] current bugaboos, the last year one of
[15:54] the hardest years, it sounds like more
[15:55] to do with your career, finances,
[15:57] profession.
[15:59] Like
[16:00] if you were because you work with men,
[16:02] if you were to look at it through that
[16:03] lens through your coaching
[16:06] profession and you were to work with
[16:08] yourself,
[16:10] what would you say
[16:13] or what would you feel that that man is
[16:15] currently
[16:16] going through.
[16:24] >> I would feel in him that he perceives
[16:27] that he's at the effect of life, that
[16:30] he's a victim.
[16:31] Um I think
[16:32] >> one part for sure. Yeah.
[16:33] >> that's a really strong way
[16:35] that I can sometimes express myself and
[16:37] I'm not proud of it and and that's
[16:39] something as well I had to really own in
[16:40] myself and reclaim that there is this
[16:42] victim that can sometimes live inside of
[16:44] me and become bitter and sulky. Um
[16:47] >> Yeah.
[16:50] >> So I think that's one for sure. Um
[16:53] >> Yeah.
[16:56] Okay. So let's just look at that. So
[16:58] let's look at the comment where your dad
[16:59] says, you know, that he's implying,
[17:02] saying, stating, declaring that you're
[17:04] weaker than your mom.
[17:06] That was in Canada. So roughly how old
[17:08] were you?
[17:10] >> 14 15
[17:11] >> Yeah.
[17:13] [clears throat]
[17:14] Would it be a fair statement to say that
[17:16] a 14 year old is actually weaker than a
[17:20] grown mother?
[17:24] >> Yeah.
[17:26] >> It is, right?
[17:28] I mean, I would say across the board,
[17:30] whoever you ask,
[17:32] especially a parent, you know, would it
[17:34] be fair to say that a 14 year old is
[17:36] weaker, more sensitive
[17:38] than a grown woman who's in her mid to
[17:40] late 30s?
[17:42] >> Yeah.
[17:45] >> So as soon as I ask that question, what
[17:47] comes to mind?
[17:51] >> Where the pain lied in for me in that
[17:54] statement that he had made is I think I
[17:56] made it mean that he questions my sense
[17:59] of
[18:00] masculinity,
[18:02] my sense of
[18:02] >> Right. I I I get the part that hurt, but
[18:05] what's happening is
[18:08] So you here sitting with me, 33 year old
[18:11] man, obviously articulate, intelligent,
[18:13] had a business, traveled the world, but
[18:15] you're still being defined by the
[18:17] narrative and the perspective of a
[18:19] child.
[18:23] Right? And it's worse because
[18:26] if you think about it, like why I'm
[18:28] using this point of relativity, so that
[18:30] you can hopefully get some relief
[18:32] immediately given how smart you are.
[18:36] If you look at it, okay, I was 14 when
[18:38] my dad made that statement.
[18:41] Now, that hurt, right? Because but it's
[18:45] not that you're
[18:47] more sensitive and weaker than your mom.
[18:49] What what's implied with that statement?
[18:59] What did that kid feel? Because we just
[19:01] objectively did a like a one-to-one
[19:03] analysis, but I would assert the world
[19:05] would agree that a 14-year-old boy is
[19:07] weaker and more sensitive than a grown
[19:10] grown woman, right?
[19:11] >> Yeah.
[19:11] >> So, we've looked at it objectively. His
[19:13] his assertion isn't inaccurate, right?
[19:18] [snorts] So, if you look at it
[19:19] objectively, okay, yeah, what's your
[19:21] point, dad? Of course, I'm [ __ ] 14,
[19:23] you know.
[19:25] But that's not what hurt you. What hurt
[19:27] you was the implication of the
[19:29] declaration.
[19:31] So, what So, he's saying it's like
[19:33] saying you're 14 and you've got two
[19:35] arms.
[19:36] It's like
[19:37] like you wouldn't get upset, right? It's
[19:39] like, oh, yeah, well
[19:41] So, what is it what is the part that was
[19:44] that was actually triggered by him
[19:46] saying that?
[19:48] >> [clears throat]
[19:49] >> This association that I'm pathetic or
[19:50] weak.
[19:52] Um.
[19:53] >> Yeah, that's that's part of it, but even
[19:55] but I would even assert again, we've got
[19:57] to stay objective here, especially with
[19:59] you and what you do for a career, right?
[20:02] Is at 14, is it still accurate to say
[20:05] that you're weak relative to an adult
[20:08] who's talking to you?
[20:09] >> Yeah.
[20:12] >> Yeah, so again, do you see there's
[20:14] Okay, great. Yeah, I'm weak. I'm 14,
[20:16] right? Do See, I'm just going to keep
[20:18] chipping away at what I would assert is
[20:20] truth, factual reality versus what we
[20:24] want to with is the underlying emotional
[20:26] implications.
[20:28] What was the
[20:29] you know, what was revealed because you
[20:32] know my work well enough, it's not
[20:33] because your dad said this that you went
[20:36] to whatever you went to is rather
[20:38] because your dad said what he said, it
[20:40] revealed what you arrived with, right?
[20:43] So again, we want to keep leaning into
[20:44] empowerment, especially in your
[20:45] particular case.
[20:47] So okay, great. So
[20:49] you know, you're weaker than your mom.
[20:52] Yeah, that's true. I I am. I'm 14, you
[20:55] know. That's that's right, dad. Thanks
[20:57] for pointing that out, you know. I'm
[20:59] relatively pathetic or I'm I'm you know,
[21:03] at some level more sensitive. Yeah,
[21:05] that's right. I'm 14. So we've still got
[21:08] to get to that none of that actually was
[21:10] what hurt
[21:12] because he's just declaring what is.
[21:16] So what was the part that that little
[21:17] boy decided at that moment
[21:22] as a relationship to those statements?
[21:25] The statements in of themselves are we
[21:27] could say factual.
[21:29] There's no there's you know, there's no
[21:30] there no hurt in facts.
[21:33] It's what you use those facts as
[21:36] evidence for.
[21:38] >> That I'm not okay as I am.
[21:40] >> Correct.
[21:41] Yeah, fundamentally, right?
[21:44] That being you is wrong.
[21:48] That being you is not enough.
[21:52] Now sit with that. If you're walking
[21:54] around and it would have been from a
[21:55] from a younger age for sure, but that
[21:58] just being Alex is fundamentally wrong.
[22:02] You're not who you're meant to be.
[22:07] What's that like living inside of that?
[22:18] >> [sighs and gasps]
[22:19] >> Heavy.
[22:21] >> Yeah.
[22:27] >> Dense.
[22:30] completely
[22:31] complete sense of powerlessness.
[22:34] >> Yeah.
[22:36] And now now in vestiges, Germany,
[22:39] Canada, Europe, Bali, like wherever you
[22:41] go, I just want you to get that it
[22:44] doesn't matter where you are,
[22:46] that who you are isn't who you're meant
[22:48] to be.
[22:49] Therefore,
[22:51] whatever your life looks like has to be
[22:53] an extension of that, right?
[22:56] Because if you're not being who you're
[22:57] meant to be, then
[22:59] commensurate with that is your life
[23:00] can't be the way it's supposed to be.
[23:03] Can you see the connection?
[23:06] So regardless of where you end up on the
[23:07] planet, Alex, you're always not who
[23:09] you're supposed to be and therefore
[23:10] you're always not where you're meant to
[23:12] be.
[23:15] Right? You've got space and time.
[23:19] So what's that like? Now as a 33 year
[23:21] old, you're in Bali, you've had the
[23:22] toughest year of your life,
[23:24] which we'll reframe, but
[23:26] that's because you're not who you're
[23:28] meant to be. Therefore, your life isn't
[23:29] the way it's meant to be either.
[23:33] >> Yeah, I mean,
[23:35] excuse my words, but it's [ __ ]
[23:36] exhausting.
[23:37] >> Yeah.
[23:38] It is, right?
[23:41] Because what's your coping strategy
[23:44] from that perspective?
[23:47] >> Push harder. I mean, performance.
[23:51] Do more.
[23:51] >> in
[23:52] late in later terms, if you're not who
[23:54] you meant to be, what are you always
[23:55] trying to be?
[23:58] >> [sighs]
[23:59] >> Sorry, can you repeat that question?
[24:01] >> Yeah, of course. So the coping strategy
[24:04] of a human being,
[24:06] if they're not who they're meant to be,
[24:08] what would it make sense that they're
[24:09] always trying to do?
[24:11] >> Myself to be myself or to be me.
[24:14] >> Well, you're not trying to be yourself,
[24:16] but if you're not who you're meant to be
[24:18] because this is an external narrative.
[24:21] >> Yeah, I'm intending to be more than just
[24:23] me.
[24:24] >> Right.
[24:25] So I would say later you're you're
[24:28] constantly trying to be who you think
[24:30] you should be
[24:33] relative to your environment.
[24:37] What's that like?
[24:39] >> Like regardless of how much I do,
[24:41] regardless of how much
[24:43] um how many accolades I might get,
[24:45] regardless of how much acknowledgement I
[24:47] might get from other people, it's never
[24:48] enough.
[24:50] >> It's never going to work. Tell me why.
[24:52] What's the driving motivator?
[24:57] >> The judgment that I have of myself.
[24:59] >> Yeah, but you're not who you're meant to
[25:01] be. So it doesn't matter what you do,
[25:03] you're always being informed by the
[25:04] fundamental lie that you're not who
[25:06] you're meant to be.
[25:08] So you might get a glimpse, you might
[25:09] get a moment like you said, okay,
[25:10] previous to this last year, you were you
[25:12] know, you had one of the better years,
[25:14] whatever that looks like, you know, you
[25:15] got some attention, you made some money,
[25:17] you had some good clients, you maybe had
[25:19] a hot girlfriend. I don't know what that
[25:21] looked like.
[25:22] But there's this illusion that oh, for
[25:24] right now, I'm finally where I'm meant
[25:26] to be
[25:28] because everything's working.
[25:31] So what is the big lie in this whole
[25:33] story?
[25:35] >> That I'm not who I'm supposed to be and
[25:37] that I'm not
[25:38] where I'm supposed to be.
[25:40] >> Yeah, so expand on that.
[25:43] What why are both of those categorical
[25:46] lies?
[25:47] >> [laughter]
[25:48] [snorts]
[25:48] >> Because I'm where
[25:50] I am where I am.
[25:52] >> Have you noticed that?
[25:55] >> And I am who I am.
[25:56] >> [laughter]
[25:57] >> In each moment. Now that's not to say
[25:59] that where you are can't change or who
[26:01] you are can't change.
[26:03] But categorically, emphatically, without
[26:05] having known you more than 25 minutes, I
[26:07] can tell you that you're always going to
[26:08] be where you are and you're always in
[26:10] that moment going to be who you are.
[26:13] [clears throat]
[26:14] That's called reality.
[26:16] But because of this slippery piece of
[26:18] code and this wiring beneath the
[26:19] surface, you're under the impression,
[26:21] through no fault of your own, but you're
[26:23] starting to garner your responsibility
[26:25] for it,
[26:26] that both of those are incorrect.
[26:29] So truth, you're always where you are
[26:32] and you're always in that moment who you
[26:34] are. Yes?
[26:35] >> Yes.
[26:37] >> Perception underneath the surface,
[26:38] you're not where you're meant to be and
[26:40] you're definitely not who you're meant
[26:41] to be.
[26:46] Allow me to introduce you to one of the
[26:48] worst conflicts in the world.
[26:49] >> That's insanity.
[26:51] >> It's pure insanity.
[26:57] Now why I allowed you to say that?
[27:04] >> Well I just consider the
[27:06] arrogance in in in proclaiming
[27:12] I know better
[27:13] and I know where I'm supposed to be and
[27:15] who I'm supposed to be.
[27:17] And obviously as well obviously as well
[27:20] the the conflict that comes
[27:22] because I'm I'm I'm trying to
[27:26] fight [snorts] and resist against
[27:27] reality.
[27:29] >> Yeah.
[27:29] >> Yeah influence it to to what I believe
[27:32] should be.
[27:33] >> Yes which is really a reflection of
[27:36] what's beneath the surface.
[27:43] What are you really looking for?
[27:47] In if you were able to influence reality
[27:50] in the way you think it should be and
[27:53] you know manipulate yourself in the way
[27:54] that you're meant to to become who you
[27:56] should be, what is the final payoff that
[27:59] you're looking for?
[28:07] >> It says peace.
[28:08] >> MO?
[28:09] >> Peace, acceptance, peace, acceptance,
[28:12] empowerment.
[28:13] >> Yeah.
[28:15] It really is right? Like if if if you if
[28:18] I could wave a magic wand and say you're
[28:21] finally who you're meant to be, how
[28:22] would you feel?
[28:25] >> Yeah peace.
[28:27] >> Peace right?
[28:28] And relative to others particularly
[28:30] looking at say your dad like what would
[28:32] that give you? If you were finally who
[28:34] you're meant to be, what might be the
[28:36] illusion, because it's an illusion, that
[28:38] you would experience from say, your dad?
[28:43] >> Acknowledgement.
[28:45] >> Yeah, what's another word for
[28:46] acknowledgement? What would a kid want?
[28:49] >> Well, I would
[28:50] Another word that came up for me is
[28:51] recognition, but yeah, probably that's
[28:53] not the answer that you're um
[28:55] Yeah, to be seen.
[28:56] >> Okay.
[28:57] >> To be seen, to be heard.
[28:59] To be
[29:00] >> And if we were to use one word for that,
[29:02] especially from the dynamic of a parent
[29:04] to a child, what does that kid want more
[29:06] than anything? Just to be
[29:09] >> Loved.
[29:10] >> Yeah, just to be loved.
[29:13] Now feel that.
[29:15] You've spent your entire life, as far as
[29:18] I'm concerned, because it would have
[29:19] been from a very early age,
[29:21] all you've been fighting for, which is,
[29:24] you know, to use your terminology, which
[29:25] is accurate, [ __ ] exhausting, is all
[29:28] you've been trying to do is become who
[29:31] you think you should be, be where you
[29:32] should be so that you get loved and
[29:34] accepted.
[29:40] Now sit with that. What's that like as a
[29:42] life?
[29:46] >> [sighs]
[29:59] >> Feels very lonely.
[30:01] >> Yeah.
[30:03] Very lonely.
[30:05] And you said earlier that it's all up to
[30:07] you, which makes sense, right?
[30:10] [clears throat]
[30:11] It's lonely. What else?
[30:14] How does that feel in your heart?
[30:16] That no matter what you do, no matter
[30:18] where you go, that it's never sufficient
[30:20] to to really garner the outcome you
[30:22] want, which is to be loved and accepted.
[30:28] >> Heartbreaking, for sure.
[30:30] >> Yeah.
[30:31] >> Um
[30:31] >> A lot of sadness there, right? Like you
[30:33] said earlier, the heaviness.
[30:35] It's a heavy heart.
[30:46] And the thing to recognize is that no
[30:48] matter how hard you try, and I can only
[30:50] imagine how hard you have tried,
[30:52] that it's futile, right?
[30:54] Again, you might get moments, but at the
[30:56] end of the day,
[30:57] because of the way you relate yourself,
[31:00] which is you're not who you're meant to
[31:01] be and you're not where you are meant to
[31:03] be, it doesn't matter, right? That's the
[31:06] driving impetus for all of these sort of
[31:09] survival strategies, coping mechanisms.
[31:12] So the energy that you're holding is the
[31:15] negation of yourself and the resistance
[31:17] to where you are.
[31:19] So it's like, you know, you've probably
[31:21] heard me say this, like one foot on the
[31:22] brake and then you're using the
[31:23] accelerator to try and overcome it, but
[31:25] the foot's always on the brake.
[31:28] >> Yeah, that's literally how it feels
[31:30] like.
[31:31] >> Yeah.
[31:32] And you're fortunate because you're 33
[31:34] and so I'm going to guess you don't have
[31:36] really too many health issues, but you
[31:38] know, there may have been stuff that was
[31:40] on the periphery and for sure in your
[31:42] predictable future, which now is already
[31:44] shifting, so it's not something to worry
[31:46] about, but when people live like that
[31:48] for another decade or two, you know,
[31:50] [ __ ] starts to fall apart
[31:54] because you're literally fighting
[31:56] yourself. You're saying on one side,
[31:58] I'm not acceptable for who I am and I'm
[32:01] not where I'm meant to be.
[32:03] So then I'm going to try as hard as I
[32:05] can to become who I think I should be,
[32:06] which is
[32:08] it it's so
[32:10] dynamic that state, right? Because it
[32:12] depends where you are, right? Like
[32:14] depends who you're talking to. If it was
[32:15] a girlfriend, you'd suddenly mold
[32:17] yourself to become who you think she
[32:18] wants you to be. If you're back in your
[32:19] parents' home, you're for sure going to
[32:21] revert back to some of the old patterns
[32:23] of making sure that you look how you're
[32:25] supposed to look in the eyes of your
[32:27] dad. Like if you're in a job, okay,
[32:29] you're an entrepreneur, but if you work
[32:30] for a company, you would mold yourself.
[32:32] Do you see it's how so many human beings
[32:34] go through life
[32:36] fundamentally, you know, manipulating
[32:38] themselves to become who they think they
[32:40] should be just to be loved and accepted,
[32:43] which is fundamentally reinforcing what?
[32:49] What's their relationship to themselves?
[32:53] >> That I'm not okay as I am.
[32:55] >> Yeah.
[32:57] They really get that. That's your life.
[33:00] You've been walking around, articulate,
[33:02] smart,
[33:03] you know, I'll give you relatively
[33:05] handsome.
[33:06] [laughter]
[33:08] [ __ ] with you, good-looking dude. And
[33:10] yet you're not okay who you are.
[33:15] Can you see the futility of that?
[33:18] [snorts]
[33:22] And it wouldn't have mattered if you'd
[33:23] got up at 5:00 and worked to 11:00 every
[33:25] day, if you'd gone to the gym, if you'd
[33:27] you know, made millions of dollars.
[33:29] There may have been some sort of
[33:30] temporary on the surface relief, but
[33:32] underneath it there would have always
[33:34] been I need to do more. I need to become
[33:36] different.
[33:38] It's this
[33:39] like absolutely
[33:41] it's so slippery that piece of code that
[33:44] you can never escape.
[33:46] No matter how successful you became.
[33:49] Do you see that?
[33:57] So again, what is the big lie?
[34:02] >> That I'm not okay as I am.
[34:04] >> Yeah.
[34:08] Now look at that.
[34:11] Where does the I'm not okay as I am?
[34:13] Where does where does that live?
[34:14] Where does that exist?
[34:18] >> In my mind?
[34:20] >> Yeah.
[34:21] In what form?
[34:24] >> Words, vibration.
[34:25] >> Yeah.
[34:26] Yeah.
[34:29] It's really just a framework
[34:33] in which you
[34:35] sort of exist, right? Exist being
[34:38] kind of accurate. Like you survive
[34:39] inside of that I am not okay as I am.
[34:44] But it's words.
[34:45] So is it an absolute truth that Alex is
[34:48] not okay as he is?
[35:01] >> I know the answer is no, but I'm still
[35:03] noticing some resistance for sure.
[35:06] >> That's okay. We've been talking for all
[35:08] of 35 minutes versus 33 years. I'm
[35:11] pretty certain that 33 years has a
[35:13] little more momentum as good as I am at
[35:15] what I do.
[35:16] >> And I'm I'm pretty stubborn as well, so.
[35:19] >> Well, you're not, but you're
[35:20] conditioning is.
[35:21] You're a sweetheart. You're free.
[35:24] But your conditioning has got a lot of,
[35:26] you know, momentum and evidence.
[35:29] So this is where, you know, you've heard
[35:31] me say it before that being right is the
[35:33] poor man's version of self-worth, right?
[35:35] You get to get some sort of
[35:38] albeit completely, you know, asinine.
[35:41] You get a a sense of
[35:44] self-justice and self-righteousness to
[35:47] know no, but look, I'll prove to you
[35:49] that I'm not who I should be. I'll prove
[35:50] to you that I should have done more with
[35:52] my life by now.
[35:57] That's the
[35:59] to use your word again, the insanity of
[36:01] the
[36:02] ego that will find evidence to maintain
[36:05] its own limitations. That's the
[36:07] self-sabotage, self-fulfilling prophecy
[36:09] of everybody, everybody's internal code.
[36:15] So I'll ask you again, is it an absolute
[36:17] truth
[36:19] that being Alex is fundamentally not
[36:22] okay?
[36:25] >> No.
[36:26] >> No, it's not, is it?
[36:28] And if you couldn't relate to yourself
[36:30] or look through that lens and the way
[36:32] that you relate to life, if that's gone,
[36:36] like it was impossible for you to have
[36:38] any self-judgment
[36:40] that is outside the parameters of being
[36:42] human. None of us are perfect, but you
[36:44] incorporate that. You know, it's like
[36:45] you're where you're at. You're who you
[36:47] are.
[36:48] Like what might that feel like if you
[36:50] for the first time perhaps ever in your
[36:52] life
[36:53] were fully, totally, completely okay
[36:56] just being you right now? And that
[36:58] doesn't mean that we get rid of
[36:59] aspirations or dreams or
[37:00] self-improvement or, you know, but right
[37:02] now as you speak with me,
[37:05] if there was nothing wrong with you and
[37:07] you couldn't believe there was anything
[37:09] wrong with you, how would that feel?
[37:16] >> Relieving is the first word that comes
[37:17] up for me.
[37:19] >> Yeah.
[37:21] Yeah, very liberating.
[37:25] How does that feel in your body?
[37:30] >> Yeah, just a lot of this weight in my
[37:31] chest just drops.
[37:36] Um
[37:37] Yeah, feeling more rootedness as well in
[37:39] my lower body.
[37:41] >> Yeah.
[37:42] >> [sighs and gasps]
[37:43] >> More expansiveness through the chest as
[37:45] I'm breathing.
[37:47] >> Yeah.
[37:49] Welcome to the moment.
[37:51] Welcome to here.
[37:53] To see
[37:55] they're they're inextricably connected.
[37:57] If you suddenly are okay being you,
[38:00] what does that also allow relative to
[38:02] where you are?
[38:07] >> [sighs and gasps]
[38:08] >> Can you repeat that one more time?
[38:10] >> Sure. So they're inextricably connected.
[38:13] We're talking about time and space, your
[38:14] relationship to you and to life, right?
[38:16] So originally
[38:19] the lives were there's something
[38:20] fundamentally wrong with you. It's not
[38:21] okay for you to be you. And hence
[38:24] if that's the case, then I want you to
[38:26] understand your relative your
[38:28] relationship to your environment
[38:30] also has to be
[38:33] um conflicted, compromised, diseased,
[38:36] right? Cuz if I'm not okay being me,
[38:38] then for sure
[38:40] I'm not living the life I'm meant to,
[38:42] right? Can you see the two are
[38:44] connected?
[38:44] >> Mhm.
[38:46] >> So what becomes available in your
[38:48] relationship to to now, to your life if
[38:51] you're suddenly okay being you, that you
[38:54] fully accept you for you?
[38:57] How does that also change your
[38:59] relationship to your surroundings, your
[39:01] environment, your circumstances?
[39:04] >> I mean, I'm I would just be in harmony
[39:05] with the way things are and the way life
[39:08] is without needing to fight it or
[39:12] need to be anywhere else.
[39:15] >> Yeah, no big deal. You just be in
[39:16] harmony in the way things are like with
[39:18] [laughter]
[39:19] I mean, I don't know. Does that sound
[39:21] slightly better than how we started this
[39:22] conversation?
[39:23] [laughter]
[39:24] Or you could just fight it.
[39:26] >> only a little bit.
[39:27] >> Only just a small amount, right. Oh, I'm
[39:29] just in harmony in the way that life is.
[39:32] Well, that sounds terrible.
[39:34] Why don't you join the rest of humanity
[39:36] who are constantly fighting reality,
[39:37] complaining, blaming, shaming, right?
[39:40] And then having all the myriad of
[39:42] diseases and [sighs and gasps] drugs
[39:44] that they're on, right?
[39:46] Yeah.
[39:47] So, all of a sudden you're at peace with
[39:49] who you are, relief, heaviness from your
[39:51] heart's gone. I'm grounded. I feel
[39:53] expansive. I'm breathing differently and
[39:56] I'm suddenly in harmony with the way
[39:58] things are.
[39:59] [sighs and gasps] Sounds like a slightly
[40:01] different life to me.
[40:05] >> Sounds like something I would like to
[40:06] experience more permanently.
[40:09] >> Yeah.
[40:10] Well, here's the funny part. That's what
[40:11] you've been looking for your entire
[40:13] life.
[40:14] You were just under the impression you
[40:15] had to become someone to get there and
[40:18] be somewhere else to feel it.
[40:20] The irony is neither of those are access
[40:22] to what you're now feeling, which is
[40:24] being right here as yourself completely
[40:27] okay with the way things are.
[40:32] Everybody, everybody
[40:34] is trying to be someone they're not and
[40:36] be somewhere they're not. Just think
[40:38] about that, the insanity.
[40:42] Have you ever been anywhere other than
[40:44] where you are?
[40:46] >> I've tried.
[40:48] >> Tried really [ __ ] hard.
[40:50] [laughter]
[40:52] Yeah, but with all due respect, how good
[40:53] was your trying?
[40:55] >> Pretty pretty lousy.
[40:57] >> Yeah.
[40:58] Yeah.
[41:01] So because you're a coach and you've got
[41:03] a smart mind, I'm going to do something
[41:05] with you that I typically don't do. I'm
[41:07] going to help people understand that
[41:09] whilst most people are under the
[41:10] impression
[41:13] that we can change our future, which
[41:14] itself is a misnomer,
[41:17] but
[41:18] would it be impressive if we can change
[41:20] your past?
[41:23] >> Very much so.
[41:24] >> Wouldn't it?
[41:25] So let's look at this last year that you
[41:28] sort of declare as being one of the
[41:29] hardest, been through the struggles.
[41:34] Now, through this lens of you don't need
[41:37] to be anyone else apart from who you
[41:39] are. There's nothing wrong with you and
[41:41] you don't need to be anywhere else apart
[41:43] from where you are. How might you be
[41:44] able to look back at your history and
[41:46] declare it otherwise?
[41:53] >> [sighs]
[41:53] >> I mean, it was just the way it was. Like
[41:55] there's no there's no significance
[41:57] around it. Like there and that's the
[41:58] thing. I've I added so much [ __ ]
[42:01] weight to the whole thing, you know?
[42:03] It's I almost envision kind of like a a
[42:05] sports team that's been on a losing
[42:07] streak for like multiple games now. It's
[42:10] kind of the same thing for me that
[42:12] it's like the more time goes on, the
[42:14] more significance comes on top of oh
[42:17] man, this has been so terrible. And
[42:19] I I notice as well as myself
[42:21] perpetuating that and the insanity of
[42:23] it. Like I I'm aware of what I'm doing
[42:26] as I'm doing it, but it's almost like I
[42:28] can't stop myself from doing it. So
[42:31] >> Beautifully said and and I'm going to
[42:33] come back to the first thing you said.
[42:36] It was what it was.
[42:40] Now, can you just feel like if your
[42:41] history in the way that Alex relates to
[42:44] it was what it was
[42:46] versus oh, it was terrible. I've really
[42:48] struggled. I've had one of the most
[42:49] challenging years of my life.
[42:52] I mean that's literally two different
[42:54] experiences of yourself and life, isn't
[43:01] We just changed your history.
[43:04] [clears throat]
[43:05] That's pretty [ __ ] cool.
[43:08] It was only significant to the previous
[43:11] narrative that was defining you at an
[43:13] unconscious level.
[43:15] So there's no fault, there's no shame,
[43:16] there's no guilt. You were looking
[43:18] through a lens of being you was
[43:20] fundamentally wrong and inadequate. So
[43:22] you're always trying to change that and
[43:25] therefore by extension the life you have
[43:28] isn't the way it should be. So it would
[43:30] make sense from that perspective looking
[43:32] even backwards that you've had one of
[43:35] the hardest most challenging years. No,
[43:37] you just been what you went through
[43:39] which is perfect relative to the way
[43:41] that you viewed yourself.
[43:44] So again not only you're in harmony in
[43:45] the way life is, which is incredibly
[43:48] powerful,
[43:50] you're in harmony with the whole of
[43:51] time.
[43:54] What would that feel like if you as a
[43:56] human being you could literally say not
[43:58] because I'm leading you but because you
[44:00] can see it for yourself, you are
[44:02] constantly in harmony with time.
[44:06] Past, present and future which are
[44:08] fundamentally conversations. There's
[44:09] only the eternal now.
[44:12] What does that what does that now make
[44:13] available? Not just looking backwards
[44:15] but looking forwards. If Alex is always
[44:18] in harmony with life,
[44:20] what does that feel like?
[44:23] >> I must say obviously to some regard it's
[44:26] liberating but to an aspect of me it's
[44:29] uh I noticing that to a part of me it's
[44:31] scary
[44:33] >> Yeah.
[44:33] >> because I I now see as well I've derived
[44:35] a sense of worth or value maybe from
[44:38] things being difficult and me being able
[44:40] to withstand difficult situations
[44:42] and almost seeing it as an
[44:45] expression of strength.
[44:47] Um
[44:49] >> Yeah and so there's no surprise you do
[44:51] men's work and I'm sure that what you
[44:53] just shared is a big part of it.
[44:58] Right?
[45:01] Cuz what would be one of the
[45:02] philosophies of your work with men in in
[45:05] in keeping what you just shared.
[45:08] >> [sighs]
[45:09] >> I mean
[45:22] Resilience is definitely something that
[45:25] I see as a virtue and it's something
[45:27] that as well that I seek to cultivate in
[45:29] my life and as well seek to aspire in
[45:31] others. Cultivating
[45:34] capacity
[45:35] to as well withstand challenging
[45:37] situations and as well to to meet them.
[45:41] Um
[45:41] >> Yeah.
[45:43] Yeah.
[45:44] And again, I don't in any way want to
[45:46] dismiss those qualities. I think
[45:48] resilience and
[45:50] the ability to face adversity and how
[45:52] you articulate in your workshops or your
[45:54] one-on-ones so what have you do. These
[45:56] aren't bad qualities, but I think
[46:00] moving forward you're going to have a
[46:01] much deeper sense of power in the way
[46:04] that you help men to
[46:08] not necessarily step into this archetype
[46:10] of being this
[46:12] macho kind of figure who can handle
[46:14] anything which is really an extension of
[46:17] well life is hard and you just got to
[46:19] like
[46:20] you know there's I'm not going to name
[46:21] names, but there's some of these big
[46:23] influencers out there who are like you
[46:25] know just
[46:26] you got to be hard and you got to deal
[46:27] with [ __ ] and
[46:29] >> Yeah.
[46:29] >> you know for me that's really a
[46:33] coping strategy built on top of an
[46:35] otherwise very fragile identity.
[46:41] So not only do you get to find massive
[46:43] relief and a profound sense of
[46:45] acceptance for your history, who you are
[46:48] as a beautiful human being
[46:50] no better or worse than anyone else.
[46:52] You're going to have your flaws and
[46:53] perfections like anyone, but you're at
[46:54] peace with that. I would assert that's
[46:57] one of the most masculine frameworks you
[46:59] could teach people.
[47:06] I personally can't think of anything
[47:08] more masculine than a man who's
[47:11] embraced his shortcomings, not as a form
[47:14] of resignation, but as a profound sense
[47:17] of acceptance. And if he
[47:20] so, you know, sees fit
[47:21] to work on those, you know, if
[47:23] somebody's
[47:25] out of shape or got weak legs that they
[47:27] they can work on them. That's okay, but
[47:29] not from a perspective of fear and
[47:31] adequacy and security or something being
[47:33] less than.
[47:38] >> Yeah, and that's as well something that
[47:40] I as well sought to adopt and like
[47:43] humility as well is something
[47:46] and as well compassion
[47:49] for as well the things I'm dealing with
[47:51] or others as well. I mean that this is
[47:53] some those are elements that are really
[47:54] important to me and you know, obviously
[47:56] strength is a value or resilience is a
[47:59] virtue, but nonetheless I as well
[48:02] very much honor the the value and the
[48:05] beauty as well of softness and
[48:06] gentleness and um
[48:09] peace, but I think I think that's also
[48:10] been sometimes,
[48:12] you know, just as well
[48:13] as it relates to my conditioning
[48:15] difficult to
[48:18] embody especially when certain
[48:20] circumstances
[48:21] might get trigger
[48:24] >> Yeah.
[48:24] >> a different way of operating.
[48:27] >> Yeah, no, I get it and it would have
[48:28] been not just difficult, would have been
[48:29] impossible from the perspective that
[48:31] there's fundamentally something wrong
[48:33] with you. You could never ever
[48:36] compensate enough for that story, do you
[48:38] see? When we have a have a inbuilt lie
[48:42] about ourselves, it doesn't matter what
[48:43] we do
[48:45] however we manipulate ourselves, it's
[48:47] never going to be sufficient. Can you
[48:48] see that?
[48:49] >> Yeah.
[48:50] >> And you know, as you're speaking like I
[48:52] think of some of these men who truly
[48:54] have influenced the course of of
[48:56] humanity
[48:58] like we can start with Jesus, right?
[49:00] Like Jesus isn't out there running
[49:01] marathons and you know, doing CrossFit
[49:04] like to prove himself, right? He's
[49:06] coming from love. We look at Gandhi,
[49:08] you know, not only
[49:10] was he quite frail, but then as he went
[49:13] through his period of starvation, you
[49:15] know, he became even more weak and yet
[49:17] he influenced like the shift of the
[49:18] course of
[49:20] a whole nation and consequently society
[49:22] and humanity,
[49:24] right? You look at Martin Luther King,
[49:26] like he wasn't there punching dudes and
[49:28] you know,
[49:29] being like a hard ass, right?
[49:33] So
[49:34] I would invite you to consider whilst
[49:36] all of these attributes of the masculine
[49:38] are very apropos and I would assert
[49:41] needed, particularly in today's society
[49:43] to have a man who does know how to
[49:44] defend his wife, his kids, his family,
[49:46] who is a stand for things like more the
[49:49] tough love that I deliver deliver to a
[49:51] lot of people is like, hey, you know,
[49:52] you're [ __ ] extraordinary. Stop, you
[49:55] know, pretending to be
[49:57] weak and all those kind of
[50:00] conversations can be helpful, but I also
[50:02] feel for you particularly
[50:04] that the the power you're looking for is
[50:08] not in some sort of compensation, but
[50:10] rather in harmony.
[50:12] >> Hm.
[50:15] >> That you get to walk this planet being
[50:18] totally okay being you at every stage of
[50:21] who you are and
[50:23] in ways that we can't fully comprehend
[50:26] accepting the way that life is right
[50:28] now.
[50:30] Like I could even off the top of my head
[50:31] think of two or three things for sure
[50:33] that
[50:34] subjectively Peter would like to be
[50:36] different in my life.
[50:38] Whatever it might be, whatever the
[50:39] circumstance, right?
[50:41] Or I can say, okay, in ways that I don't
[50:43] understand
[50:45] there's a timing to things. Perhaps what
[50:47] I think is what I want is not really
[50:49] what's going to be best for me in the
[50:51] long run and I'm going to trust that
[50:52] there's a greater intelligence that is
[50:54] going to deliver something in a day, a
[50:56] week or month that will explain why my
[50:58] personal subjective preference isn't
[51:00] being fulfilled.
[51:02] >> Hm.
[51:03] >> Can you see that's a much more powerful
[51:05] way to live? I'm not trying to
[51:07] manipulate life. I co-create with life.
[51:09] I have whatever impact I can for sure.
[51:13] But I'm not fundamentally fighting
[51:15] reality.
[51:22] >> No, I see and feel as well the truth in
[51:26] the things that you're stating and
[51:27] frankly as well have experienced deep
[51:30] forms of harmony and
[51:32] um as well using some of your language.
[51:34] It It does feel like I'm as well
[51:35] flip-flopping
[51:37] >> Yeah.
[51:39] >> between experiencing that as well
[51:41] feeling the potency and the power
[51:44] of
[51:45] uh you know being in complete complete
[51:47] harmony and as well flow with the way
[51:49] things are and um
[51:50] >> Yeah.
[51:52] >> there's something really beautiful when
[51:53] I'm in that state and I actually feel
[51:56] very radiant and there is a certain
[51:58] magnetism uh as well around me and as
[52:01] well in relationship to others
[52:03] that I would truly love to experience
[52:05] more of in my life but more often than
[52:08] not it's more um the former
[52:11] uh with the struggle. Um and yeah
[52:14] frankly I would love to experience more
[52:15] of that
[52:16] that radiance, that abundance and um
[52:19] magnetism.
[52:21] >> Yeah, well I would assert that based on
[52:23] this conversation today that's what's
[52:25] going to happen.
[52:26] Because you're smart you're going to get
[52:28] it which is uh if we keep it very simple
[52:31] if there's something wrong with you and
[52:33] you're not
[52:34] who you're meant to be
[52:35] and you're not where you're meant to be
[52:38] the the basic way of saying that is
[52:41] you're in a constant state of
[52:42] self-rejection.
[52:47] And if that's your relationship to
[52:49] yourself then it has to by extension be
[52:51] a relationship to everything and
[52:53] everyone around you.
[52:55] >> Yeah.
[52:56] >> Is a state of rejection
[52:59] anything to do with abundance?
[53:01] >> No.
[53:03] >> No.
[53:03] So if you get rid of the rejection of
[53:05] self, introduce what I would assert is
[53:07] your birthright, which is love of self.
[53:10] Not in the gratuitous like, you know,
[53:12] soak, suds, and manicures and massages,
[53:15] but really a profound self-acceptance
[53:18] that I am who I am,
[53:20] and I'm okay with that.
[53:23] Can you see that then that by extension
[53:25] gets offered to everyone around you and
[53:27] your life around you, which to me is
[53:29] abundance?
[53:31] You said earlier that that little boy
[53:33] wanted to be seen, wanted to be held,
[53:34] wanted to be heard, which I said what
[53:36] does that equate to? Being loved.
[53:38] If you are in complete harmony with you
[53:40] and life, that is being loved, that is
[53:43] being held, that is being seen. You
[53:45] You're literally part of the universe. I
[53:47] can't think of anything more abundant.
[53:56] [sighs and gasps]
[53:57] You see that?
[53:59] Versus little old you fighting the whole
[54:01] universe.
[54:03] You know, you don't have to be a rocket
[54:04] scientist to guess who's going to win
[54:05] that one.
[54:07] >> Yeah.
[54:10] Yeah, and I would as well love to be a
[54:12] stand as well for
[54:14] that expression so I can as well inspire
[54:17] or evoke that in individuals that I come
[54:20] across, whether it's in my interactions,
[54:22] whether it's in conversations, whether
[54:24] it's friends or as well the clients that
[54:27] I work with. So
[54:28] um
[54:30] Yeah, I think it's also important for me
[54:31] to do that not just for myself, but also
[54:34] because that's what I want to inspire
[54:35] because, you know, I
[54:37] I see as well so many men struggling in
[54:39] the same ways that I do and I I feel
[54:41] like I don't want to perpetuate that in
[54:44] my own expression and as well in in a
[54:46] way as well support them and
[54:49] perpetuating that in them.
[54:51] >> Yeah.
[54:52] You You will. You You From this
[54:55] perspective, you will have no choice,
[54:56] and I can tell you this categorically
[54:58] because of having done this for 25 plus
[55:01] years.
[55:02] There's nothing a human being wants more
[55:05] than what you're tapping into right now,
[55:07] which is to be totally okay and fully
[55:09] accepting of themselves.
[55:13] Every kid at some point hears that what
[55:15] they did was wrong or bad or who they
[55:17] are is not enough or they're somehow
[55:19] less than their brother or their sister.
[55:21] of that narrative points to
[55:23] fundamentally that being you is not
[55:25] enough.
[55:27] That is one of the deepest pieces of
[55:29] code that drives humanity and as a
[55:31] result we have a society of
[55:33] perfectionists, people who are
[55:35] constantly trying to compensate, people
[55:36] who are constantly manipulating
[55:38] themselves, compromising themselves even
[55:40] in relationships where they abandon
[55:42] themselves. The number of people who
[55:43] will betray themselves
[55:46] just to try and be loved by another, not
[55:48] realizing that the others doing the same
[55:50] thing and then wondering why their
[55:51] relationship doesn't work.
[55:54] You now have a fighting chance, a real,
[55:57] absolute, authentic opportunity to truly
[56:01] win at life by by virtue of just
[56:03] allowing yourself to be you,
[56:06] which grants other people the permission
[56:07] to be them, not that it was ever yours
[56:09] to give, but energetically they'll feel
[56:11] that around you. They'll be like I don't
[56:12] know what it is, I just love being
[56:14] around Alex. Well,
[56:15] you know what it is is that he's not
[56:17] judging you because he's not judging
[56:19] him.
[56:20] >> Yeah.
[56:24] >> That's beauty, that 's love.
[56:27] And I guarantee you that whoever you
[56:28] work with, whatever workshops you do,
[56:31] every single person you come across will
[56:33] at some level be fighting their own idea
[56:36] of themselves.
[56:38] And that is suffering that leads to
[56:39] disease, disharmony,
[56:42] and all of the other things that people
[56:43] struggle with
[56:45] typically for their entire life.
[56:50] So not only do I hope that this is a
[56:51] gift to you, I'm pretty sure it is, that
[56:54] you went from a world
[56:56] of constantly trying to be elsewhere and
[56:58] be someone else, which is exhausting,
[57:01] to now
[57:03] landing finally in the moment being
[57:05] totally at peace with you,
[57:07] being totally accepting of the way
[57:08] things are whilst remaining committed to
[57:10] the way things you'd like them to be or
[57:12] the co-creation that you have with life,
[57:15] the aspirations you have for yourself,
[57:17] these are all beautiful, but
[57:19] whilst still being in harmony with who
[57:22] you are and where you are each moment.
[57:26] That's an entirely different existence.
[57:28] And to be able to extend that, offer
[57:30] that and just mimic it for other people,
[57:32] I can't think of a greater purpose.
[57:38] Because I know in my work, you know,
[57:40] probably closer to three decades at this
[57:41] point, I've yet to meet anybody who's
[57:44] fully at peace with who they are or
[57:45] where they are.
[57:47] Just think about that.
[57:53] You now have the opportunity to invite
[57:55] people to join you in that place.
[57:58] What would that be like?
[58:07] >> It would feel really meaningful and it
[58:09] would feel as well very aligned um
[58:12] to what I would describe as my purpose.
[58:14] I mean my company's called Heart of Man
[58:16] and as well have a podcast called Heart
[58:18] of Man and
[58:19] >> Mhm.
[58:20] >> this is as well what I want to evoke in
[58:21] in men, you know, this this this beauty
[58:24] of their hearts and as well
[58:27] the power of that and I think it's it's
[58:30] going on the journey that I've been on
[58:32] is
[58:33] has
[58:34] been as well about me coming into deeper
[58:36] contact of that,
[58:38] yeah, with myself as well.
[58:40] >> Yeah.
[58:42] So now moving forward as you head back
[58:44] to Germany here in five weeks, if you
[58:46] were to get on the plane, you know, you
[58:49] got five weeks to go through but go to
[58:51] Germany, arrive in Germany, be at your
[58:52] house,
[58:54] what would it feel like now relative to
[58:57] the future you were probably perceiving
[58:59] and anticipating with a certain degree
[59:00] of anxiety that
[59:02] no matter what you're okay being you and
[59:05] no matter where you're okay being there,
[59:07] what would that feel like now looking at
[59:10] your future?
[59:15] >> It I would feel a sense of excitement.
[59:17] >> Yeah, [clears throat] slightly
[59:18] different, isn't it?
[59:19] >> Yeah.
[59:21] Yeah, sense of like yeah, let's go.
[59:24] Let's make it happen.
[59:25] >> Slightly different than how we started
[59:27] this conversation in your view of
[59:29] Germany and all the bullying. Yeah.
[59:30] Yeah.
[59:31] >> Yeah.
[59:33] >> So
[59:34] just as we wrap up, it give me tingles
[59:36] now thinking about what I'm about to
[59:38] say.
[59:39] Whilst
[59:41] you have all my love and compassion for
[59:42] what you went through both in Germany
[59:44] and Canada with regards to bullying and
[59:46] how long that lasted two, three, five
[59:48] years.
[59:49] I don't wish that on any kid.
[59:52] But what I want you to recognize there
[59:54] has been no worse form of bullying than
[59:56] what you have unconsciously done for
[59:58] yourself for the last 15 to 20.
[1:00:06] You see that?
[1:00:10] >> Yeah.
[1:00:12] >> You want to keep doing that?
[1:00:14] >> No.
[1:00:15] >> No.
[1:00:18] So without sounding cliché, you just got
[1:00:21] a glimpse of what I would assert every
[1:00:22] human being is here to discover, which
[1:00:25] is
[1:00:26] profound love of self.
[1:00:31] [sighs]
[1:00:34] And none of it was your fault because it
[1:00:35] was all unconscious, but because of that
[1:00:37] particular framework, because of that
[1:00:39] narrative, you thinking there's
[1:00:41] fundamentally something wrong with you,
[1:00:43] there's no greater form of harm or
[1:00:45] bullying.
[1:00:47] >> Yeah. I can see that.
[1:00:48] >> for the
[1:00:49] first time in your life, you get to stop
[1:00:51] doing that.
[1:00:55] I'm going to guess that would be a
[1:00:56] slight improvement.
[1:00:58] >> Yeah, and that's what I commit to.
[1:01:01] >> Yeah.
[1:01:03] Well, welcome to you. Welcome to where
[1:01:04] you are. Welcome to love.
[1:01:07] And
[1:01:08] from that place, you now get to
[1:01:12] pay it forward,
[1:01:14] share it with others.
[1:01:17] We'd not the secret.
[1:01:19] Uh?
[1:01:21] It would be a pleasure. It would be an
[1:01:22] honor and
[1:01:23] yeah, that's that's all I want to do.
[1:01:26] That's all I'm interested in doing.
[1:01:28] >> That's all anyone's looking for, so it's
[1:01:30] a match made in heaven.
[1:01:34] Sound good?
[1:01:37] >> Thank you so much, Peter.
[1:01:38] This has been incredible and has shared
[1:01:41] what an honor for me, so thank you.
[1:01:44] >> Well, hopefully I lived up to
[1:01:46] expectations.
[1:01:47] >> You did. [laughter]
[1:01:48] You definitely did. Yeah.
[1:01:50] >> Yeah. Well, you my friend have got a big
[1:01:52] heart. Your company's name is Apropos.
[1:01:56] I would assert now not in any way to
[1:01:58] diminish or dismiss what you've done,
[1:02:00] the great work you've done, but now you
[1:02:02] truly have a an opportunity to help men
[1:02:05] tap into their heart, which of course we
[1:02:07] all know is
[1:02:08] as anatomically speaking it's correlated
[1:02:11] to love, you know? And now you get to
[1:02:13] love you. You get to love life the way
[1:02:15] it is and help others find the same.
[1:02:18] I can't think of a better purpose.
[1:02:21] >> I agree and I'm very much looking
[1:02:23] forward to
[1:02:24] that and continuing it.
[1:02:27] >> Yeah. Well, I hope our paths cross
[1:02:28] somewhere in Europe or Bali or wherever
[1:02:30] and we can hug it out and
[1:02:33] >> I would absolutely love that.
[1:02:35] >> Yeah, except wherever we are and realize
[1:02:37] that life is never
[1:02:39] really perfect, but in for that reason
[1:02:41] it is the way it is and if we can be in
[1:02:43] harmony with that then
[1:02:45] that's a life of peace.
[1:02:47] >> Yeah.
[1:02:49] Thank you so much, Peter.
[1:02:51] >> You're welcome my friend. A joy to be
[1:02:52] with you. I am excited to you know,
[1:02:54] we'll check in in a few weeks and see
[1:02:56] where you're at, but I I've got a good
[1:02:58] feeling that
[1:03:00] whilst you were under the impression
[1:03:01] you've been through one of the hardest
[1:03:02] years, which you yourself rephrased and
[1:03:05] recognized it is what it was
[1:03:08] or it was what it was and now, you know,
[1:03:10] I'm curious to see how life occurs
[1:03:12] because energetically if we you know,
[1:03:14] without getting too much into the
[1:03:17] the physics of it your frequency shifts,
[1:03:20] you know, as your relationship to
[1:03:22] yourself shifts, life is going to
[1:03:23] re-coordinate itself around you. It's
[1:03:26] going to configure people and
[1:03:28] circumstances to meet you in the space
[1:03:30] of love and acceptance and
[1:03:32] that's pretty exciting.
[1:03:34] >> I agree and uh yeah, just excited and
[1:03:37] eager as well to await what is to come
[1:03:39] and uh you'll definitely as well see me.
[1:03:41] I don't know if you're aware of the fact
[1:03:42] that I'm as well part of the current
[1:03:43] mastermind, so uh I'll at least see you
[1:03:46] there, so.
[1:03:47] >> Okay, amazing. All right, well I hope
[1:03:49] you're enjoying that.
[1:03:50] >> Definitely, man. It's It's been
[1:03:52] incredible and yeah, for anyone as well
[1:03:54] listening I I it's it's my first time
[1:03:56] ever since like you know since
[1:03:57] experiencing your work six years ago and
[1:04:00] um
[1:04:00] yeah, it's been an incredible ride as
[1:04:02] well to be a part of that, so.
[1:04:04] >> Yeah, it's pretty remarkable to see
[1:04:05] those changes like you're going through
[1:04:07] right now over and over, right? It's
[1:04:08] just
[1:04:09] >> Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. There's been a
[1:04:11] number of times where I was bawling my
[1:04:12] eyes.
[1:04:13] >> [laughter]
[1:04:13] >> Yeah, yeah. You and everybody else.
[1:04:15] Yeah, it's really beautiful. Well, I'm
[1:04:17] glad you're in it then I'll see you in a
[1:04:18] couple of Saturdays and uh
[1:04:20] yeah, get out there, be you fully fully
[1:04:23] unapologetically you um
[1:04:26] self-accepting in a state of peace and
[1:04:28] recognize life is the way it is
[1:04:31] and it's nothing that you can't handle.
[1:04:32] In fact, the more you embrace it, the
[1:04:34] more that life will equally embrace you.
[1:04:37] >> Thank you, Peter. It's been such a
[1:04:38] pleasure.
[1:04:40] >> Likewise, my friend.
[1:04:42] If you enjoyed that episode of Finding
[1:04:44] Freedom, then I invite you to check out
[1:04:46] another episode, click right here.