Transcript
[0:10] Hello, my name is Susan Piver. I'm a
[0:12] writer and long-time practitioner and
[0:15] teacher of Buddhism.
[0:17] I've come to see that many people think
[0:18] of Buddhism and meditation practices
[0:22] associated with it, like mindfulness, as
[0:24] ways to reduce stress, but I would like
[0:27] to tell you that the Buddhist path is
[0:29] far more rich than that.
[0:31] It is a way to wake up, to become
[0:34] liberated from suffering,
[0:36] and forget about enlightenment, it's
[0:37] also a way to live your everyday life
[0:40] more fully and meaningfully.
[0:43] This podcast is to share with you
[0:45] classical Buddhist teachings that I have
[0:46] found enormously beneficial, and also to
[0:49] tell stories from my own life about how
[0:51] I applied and misapplied these
[0:53] teachings. And I do want to tell you
[0:55] from my more than 30 years of experience
[0:58] that the Dharma is real, and it provides
[1:02] an extraordinarily nuanced, profound,
[1:06] and pragmatic guidebook to living a life
[1:10] of wisdom, compassion, and courage.
[1:16] I want to start this conversation about
[1:19] so-called, but also very real, dark side
[1:22] of mindfulness, as it was recently
[1:24] called in Atlantic magazine, by saying I
[1:28] have PTSD. Many, many people do, and I
[1:31] am among them. This is not a diagnosis
[1:33] that I gave myself. I was actually
[1:35] diagnosed long ago by Bessel van der
[1:37] Kolk, one of the leading thinkers in
[1:41] modern views of cause and treatment for
[1:44] PTSD. I even had treatment from him
[1:47] briefly a long time ago.
[1:48] And the reason I have PTSD, as far as I
[1:51] know,
[1:52] is that I was in a very bad car accident
[1:55] a long time ago. I may have mentioned
[1:56] this in other episodes of this podcast.
[1:59] I was hit by a drunk driver. I didn't
[2:01] see it coming. No one expected me to
[2:04] live.
[2:05] I had injuries to my organs that were
[2:08] almost always fatal.
[2:10] And I have no
[2:12] memory whatsoever of this event.
[2:15] All I know is I woke up in the hospital
[2:18] wondering what had happened. And it was
[2:20] told to me, you were hit by a drunk
[2:22] driver. You were thrown out of the
[2:23] passenger door. You landed on some
[2:25] grass. An ambulance came. These were
[2:27] your injuries. And I'm listening like,
[2:30] what are you people talking about?
[2:32] In other words, they could have told me
[2:33] anything. They could have said, you were
[2:34] abducted by aliens and we found you on
[2:37] the street. And I would have been, oh,
[2:39] well, I guess that's what happened. So,
[2:42] one of the reasons I'm mentioning this
[2:43] is when there is a trauma that you
[2:46] cannot remember,
[2:48] although I see evidence of it in my body
[2:50] and my movement all the time, it creates
[2:52] a particular flavor of trauma
[2:56] because the source of the trauma cannot
[2:58] be assigned. In other words, if I had
[3:00] fallen off a horse, I would say to
[3:03] myself, well, don't get back on a horse.
[3:05] Then I might be able to calm down as
[3:06] long as I wasn't on a horse or wasn't
[3:08] watching a movie of a person on a horse.
[3:10] But because I can't assign it to
[3:12] anything, it has created, I've learned
[3:15] in the intervening years, cuz this was
[3:17] many years ago,
[3:18] that there's a perpetual sense that
[3:21] something terrible could come out of the
[3:23] blue
[3:25] at any moment and take my life.
[3:28] P.S. That happens to be true, and not
[3:30] just for me. It's
[3:32] a weird thing.
[3:33] However, I am hope that most of us don't
[3:36] walk around thinking that. But in my
[3:39] mind, in my body, in my psychology, part
[3:42] of me does, even though again, it was
[3:44] many years ago.
[3:45] The source of trauma is in the
[3:48] environment, not attached to a
[3:50] particular set of circumstances. So,
[3:53] why am I telling you all this? The first
[3:55] time I went on a long meditation
[3:56] retreat, it was 2 weeks, it was in the
[3:58] mountains, it was beautiful, the
[3:59] teachers were great,
[4:01] the other people were nice. I noticed
[4:03] almost immediately every time the gong
[4:05] was rang to signal the beginning or end
[4:08] of a meditation session,
[4:10] I almost jumped out of my skin.
[4:13] I startled so hard and I learned
[4:15] subsequently that this is called a
[4:17] startle response, which is something not
[4:21] uncommon at all with survivors of
[4:23] trauma. So, back then, this is 25 years
[4:26] ago, there was not sensitivity to such
[4:30] things, certainly in the general
[4:32] population and
[4:34] also certainly not among meditation
[4:36] teachers.
[4:37] So, the advice that someone like me
[4:39] would have gotten if I had talked to
[4:40] anyone about it, which I didn't, was
[4:44] "Oh, your ego is trying to bust through
[4:47] a limitation."
[4:49] Please.
[4:50] That makes me mad.
[4:52] Or, "Just sit with it." is the most
[4:55] conventional response, at least it would
[4:57] have been back then.
[4:58] "Just watch it arise, abide, and
[5:00] dissolve." That's not bad advice,
[5:03] but it leaves out a piece of human
[5:06] warmth and understanding that could have
[5:10] mitigated fear on the heart of the
[5:12] practitioner, namely myself in this
[5:14] case.
[5:15] So, I just want to bring that up before
[5:19] I talk to you about this article in The
[5:22] Atlantic called The Dark Side of
[5:25] Mindfulness, because many people sent it
[5:27] to me.
[5:28] When I read it, I thought, "I think I've
[5:30] read this before." It was published in
[5:33] September of 2026, and I went and did a
[5:36] little mousing around online and found
[5:39] that indeed the
[5:41] Atlantic had published another article
[5:44] called The Dark Night of the Soul, and
[5:47] for some reason they spelled it k n i g
[5:50] h t. The subtitle for some meditation
[5:53] has become more curse than cure and this
[5:55] was published in June of 2014.
[5:59] Both articles interviewed the same
[6:00] person, a noted researcher named Dr.
[6:03] Britton in Providence, Rhode Island. I'm
[6:05] sure she's very smart and wonderful and
[6:07] insightful.
[6:09] And I just found it interesting that
[6:10] they basically published two articles,
[6:14] you know, 12 years apart with some
[6:16] suspicions
[6:18] about meditation as it was called in the
[6:20] first article in 2014
[6:22] or mindfulness as it was called in the
[6:24] current article from last month. In both
[6:28] articles, the word dark was used. The
[6:30] dark night of the soul, the dark side of
[6:33] mindfulness.
[6:35] Okay, well, there is a dark side and I
[6:37] want to talk to you in this episode
[6:39] about becoming sensitive to that, why
[6:42] that might happen, why is there a dark
[6:44] side, and what to look out for. And
[6:47] then, we're going to go back to the
[6:48] podcast after party post this
[6:51] conversation where I share a song with
[6:53] you that I love and explain why I love
[6:56] it and hope you will love it, too. So,
[6:58] in the current article, it begins with
[7:01] some history about Dr. Britton in 2004.
[7:04] She did a study on meditation, which she
[7:08] thought would prove that it helps you
[7:11] sleep better.
[7:12] Okay, meditation could help you sleep
[7:14] better. Got it. The next paragraph says,
[7:18] "She had become deeply invested in
[7:20] Buddhist teachings."
[7:21] So, what I want to point out here is the
[7:23] first paragraph talks about meditation
[7:25] as being helpful.
[7:27] The second paragraph talks about
[7:29] Buddhist teachings. But nowhere does it
[7:31] say
[7:32] that these are different things.
[7:35] Buddhist teachings about meditation are
[7:38] certainly profound and real. I've
[7:39] devoted my in to them.
[7:41] However, it would be incorrect to
[7:43] conflate mindfulness
[7:46] with Buddhism.
[7:48] Buddhism has many meditation practices,
[7:50] that's for sure. But right away in this
[7:52] article, there's no sense of delineating
[7:55] between the world of mindfulness and the
[7:57] world of Buddhist teachings.
[7:59] It's very important to make that
[8:01] delineation yourself when you are trying
[8:04] to make your own decisions about this
[8:06] dark side, where does it come from, what
[8:08] does it mean, how does it happen?
[8:10] Because right away it's casting
[8:11] aspersion not just on
[8:14] mindfulness, as again they call it, but
[8:16] on Buddhist teachings.
[8:18] Yeah, some of them are not very helpful.
[8:20] But to devote yourself to meditation is
[8:23] not the same thing as devoting yourself
[8:25] to Buddhism.
[8:26] So, I think that's important to point
[8:28] out. She finds out in her study about
[8:31] meditation helping people sleep better
[8:33] is that it's actually the opposite.
[8:36] It helps people sleep worse.
[8:38] Well, how can that be, she wonders. So,
[8:39] she talked to an unnamed meditation
[8:42] teacher, {quote} {unquote}, who said,
[8:44] "Everybody knows if you meditate enough
[8:46] you stop sleeping." That's a quote from,
[8:48] again, the unnamed meditation teacher.
[8:51] I never heard that in my whole life.
[8:53] I've been practicing for over 30 years
[8:56] and I've been teaching for maybe 15 and
[8:58] I never heard in my whole life everybody
[9:01] knows this thing that we stop sleeping.
[9:04] I don't know where that came from. This
[9:05] person wasn't named.
[9:07] This conclusion was not attributed to
[9:10] anything.
[9:12] So, okay, well,
[9:13] according to the article, again, Dr.
[9:15] Britton said, "Well, what else aren't
[9:16] you telling us about meditation?"
[9:18] So, the article unfolds from there
[9:21] talking about things that you might not
[9:22] know about meditation. And okay, that is
[9:25] useful. I have no problem with any of
[9:26] this, personally.
[9:28] However, what I would say is that part
[9:31] of what contributes to darkness or
[9:34] difficulty
[9:35] resulting from meditation practice
[9:38] is the idea that meditation practice
[9:41] is designed to help you do anything
[9:45] better.
[9:46] Sleep better, be patient better,
[9:49] lead better, perform better,
[9:53] be nicer better.
[9:55] That's all incorrect. If I was titling
[9:58] this article, I might have titled it
[10:00] something like the dark side of
[10:03] self-help industry, not the dark side of
[10:05] mindfulness, but when mindfulness is
[10:08] co-opted into self-help,
[10:11] it's going to fix you.
[10:12] Well, that is not what it was designed
[10:15] for.
[10:16] So, it's a square peg in a round hole
[10:18] situation.
[10:20] It's a spiritual practice.
[10:22] It's not a fix-me practice.
[10:25] Spiritual practices come with
[10:28] warnings, or should,
[10:30] caveats,
[10:32] and cautions, none of which are included
[10:36] if you go to an app to learn meditation
[10:39] or get instruction from a friend that
[10:40] just did a mindfulness course.
[10:42] It's extremely important. This is what I
[10:45] was taught. And when I teach people how
[10:47] to teach meditation, I try to impart
[10:49] this without hesitation.
[10:52] If you want to learn to meditate, it's
[10:54] important to learn from a teacher who
[10:56] has been trained to teach meditation
[11:00] because it creates a complex sequence of
[11:04] responses that cannot be predicted. I
[11:06] don't care what science says. Get out of
[11:08] here, science, for a minute. Each of us
[11:11] responds differently when we sit with
[11:14] ourselves in silence.
[11:16] One of the things that seems to happen
[11:18] to almost all of us, each in our own
[11:20] way,
[11:21] is not that we become quieter or more
[11:24] peaceful.
[11:26] Meditation amplifies
[11:28] the inner state. It does not peace it
[11:31] out. So, if your inner state is bored or
[11:35] heartbroken or sleepy or excited,
[11:39] you will notice more directly what it
[11:42] feels like to be those things.
[11:44] When you next sit down, if you're
[11:46] feeling all sorts of other thing,
[11:48] you will notice those other things more
[11:51] viscerally.
[11:52] So, it does not quiet you.
[11:55] It enters you more deeply into your
[11:58] experience. Then what? Well, that's
[12:01] where the dark side can come up if
[12:02] there's no one there to help you answer
[12:04] that question.
[12:05] Then what? So, in no way am I saying you
[12:08] need a guru or to look for someone
[12:10] dressed in robes tell you what to do.
[12:12] You have to figure it out.
[12:15] What we need
[12:16] on the path,
[12:18] especially in the beginning,
[12:20] is not gurus or
[12:22] people that try to tell you what to do.
[12:25] We need friends.
[12:27] A meditation teacher is a spiritual
[12:29] friend, Kalyana Mitra in Sanskrit, not a
[12:34] teacher
[12:35] in the conventional sense.
[12:37] I am a friend
[12:39] who has been doing this longer than you.
[12:41] That's it.
[12:42] So, it's important to learn from someone
[12:44] that has been trained to teach, not
[12:45] because
[12:46] they're enlightened, unless they are,
[12:48] which would be awesome,
[12:49] but because they have more experience
[12:51] than you
[12:52] and can help you sense the twists and
[12:55] turns as a friend.
[12:57] So, the first article published by the
[12:58] Atlantic on this topic, Dark Night of
[13:00] Soul, k n i g h t, again, I don't know
[13:03] why it's like the dude in the armor not
[13:06] like what happens when daytime is over.
[13:08] It talks about a person, a young man
[13:12] named David,
[13:13] who went on a lengthy retreat and
[13:17] started freaking out, basically. Had
[13:19] some sort of a mental break or a
[13:21] psychotic break, I'm not sure. The
[13:23] article doesn't say, but it does
[13:25] describe what sounds like some kind of a
[13:27] break. Seeing visions of devils and
[13:31] hearing or sensing the presence of
[13:35] something that wants you to kill
[13:36] yourself. Very bad. Very, very bad.
[13:39] Confusing
[13:40] at best.
[13:42] Terrifying
[13:43] at worst. Is this the fault of
[13:46] meditation? Well, meditation, I would
[13:48] say, played a role. And I again, I don't
[13:50] know how I just read this article like
[13:52] everybody else.
[13:53] But what I would guess
[13:56] is more likely to be culpable
[14:00] is not the practice of meditation, but
[14:03] the environment that surrounded the
[14:06] practice of meditation
[14:08] in this particular retreat. My guess is
[14:11] that this was a silent retreat
[14:14] where all forms of communication were
[14:17] contraindicated, meaning not just
[14:19] talking, but looking at people and
[14:21] smiling at them and gesturing and that
[14:23] kind of thing. And that can be a
[14:25] powerful and wonderful experience to
[14:27] just quiet yourself so thoroughly within
[14:32] the container of a community. For the
[14:35] vast majority of people that do such
[14:37] things, it's beneficial, powerful.
[14:40] But for some, what is amplified within
[14:44] becomes increasingly frightening when
[14:47] there is no one to talk to about it. Or
[14:50] when you do talk to someone about it,
[14:52] they say, "Just sit with it." Or your
[14:56] ego's busting through some karmic
[14:58] limitation or some other such
[15:01] When a person needs care and support and
[15:05] warmth on the spiritual path, it should
[15:08] not be withheld in the name of someone's
[15:10] rulebook. Nor should it be offered by
[15:13] people who are making up,
[15:15] unqualified. That's why it's important
[15:17] to learn with a teacher, a meditation
[15:19] teacher. So, both articles further go on
[15:22] to say meditation is a multi-billion
[15:24] dollar industry with some sense that
[15:27] meditation is trying to hoodwink you or
[15:29] pull the wool over your eyes and yeah,
[15:31] there are some people out there that are
[15:32] full of and that are trying to
[15:33] hoodwink you and pull the wool over your
[15:35] eyes and get your cash money and not
[15:37] leave you with anything for it.
[15:39] That's not my experience of
[15:41] the world of meditation within Buddhism.
[15:45] It is, however, very good clickbait. So,
[15:48] you know, kudos for that. So, there are
[15:50] certain things to look for in a
[15:52] meditation retreat or meditation
[15:54] environment or class that can construct
[15:59] guardrails for your experience.
[16:02] The first guardrail is already
[16:05] mentioned, learn from someone who has
[16:08] been trained to teach. Second, from
[16:11] within a lineage that is more than 2,500
[16:15] years old.
[16:17] That's the line in the sand that I would
[16:19] like to draw.
[16:20] You don't have to join that lineage, you
[16:22] don't have to shave your head, you don't
[16:23] have to wear robes, you don't have to
[16:24] chant things in other languages, but
[16:27] your teacher should be rooted in lineage
[16:30] and they should not try to make you be
[16:32] in that lineage. If so, you should
[16:34] leave.
[16:35] The truth about meditation instruction
[16:37] or a truth and when I teach others how
[16:39] to teach,
[16:40] I try to also emphasize this.
[16:44] It's not an explanation.
[16:46] When you teach someone to meditate, it
[16:48] is a transmission
[16:50] rather than an explanation. So, it has
[16:53] nothing to do with wearing flowing
[16:55] garments or chanting mantras or casting
[16:59] spells.
[17:00] What it means is that I, I'll use myself
[17:03] as an example because I'm the one
[17:05] chatting. I was taught to meditate by my
[17:08] teacher. Sam, his name is Sam. He was
[17:11] taught to meditate by his teacher,
[17:13] Chögyam Trungpa Rinpoche,
[17:15] as it happens. Chögyam Trungpa Rinpoche,
[17:18] a controversial, magical, powerful,
[17:20] unknowable Tibetan meditation master,
[17:24] was taught by his teachers, one of whom
[17:26] was called Khenpo Gangshar. Khenpo
[17:29] Gangshar was taught by his teacher, who
[17:32] was taught by her teacher, who was
[17:33] taught by their teacher, on and on and
[17:36] on, presumably back to the historic
[17:38] Buddha. So, this does not mean that I or
[17:41] Sam or anyone is sitting in for Buddha.
[17:44] It does, however, mean there is some
[17:46] kind of an unbroken line. A handoff has
[17:50] been made over 2,500 years, presumably.
[17:53] I'm sure it's more complicated than
[17:54] that. And now I'm talking about it. And
[17:57] if you train to teach, then you'll be
[17:59] talking about it. That through line is
[18:02] what creates the transmission quality.
[18:05] It makes meditation instruction
[18:08] something more powerful than an
[18:11] explanation of how you can fix yourself.
[18:14] When meditation is some aspect of
[18:17] self-help, a way to fix yourself,
[18:19] you know, including really difficult
[18:21] problems like not being able to sleep
[18:23] and having anger issues and things that
[18:25] Yeah, please try to fix those if you
[18:27] have them. I hope you will be
[18:28] successful.
[18:29] But when meditation is included in a
[18:32] self-help regimen,
[18:33] it is co-opted by the self-help view
[18:37] that you are broken and you need to be
[18:39] fixed.
[18:40] Hell, I'm broken. I need to be fixed.
[18:43] Cool. Please, bring on your self-help.
[18:45] I'll take what you're offering.
[18:48] However, meditation does not belong in
[18:50] that matrix because meditation starts
[18:53] from the opposite point of view, which
[18:55] is you are completely whole, full,
[19:00] worthy, integrated, brilliant, right
[19:04] now.
[19:05] That's how you were born. Any notion to
[19:07] the contrary is a sign of confusion, and
[19:10] the confusion needs to be attended to,
[19:12] not the issues that created the
[19:14] confusion.
[19:15] So, I hope you can see what I'm talking
[19:17] about here. Meditation on the self-help
[19:20] menu starts with you're broken. Well,
[19:24] that's not where meditation comes from.
[19:27] Meditation comes from
[19:29] your brain. Please relax sufficiently so
[19:32] that you can see that.
[19:34] When you see it fully, presumably, your
[19:36] ability to help others to also see that
[19:39] will be vastly enhanced.
[19:42] And that is among the primary points of
[19:45] meditation practice.
[19:47] To help you to be of greater benefit in
[19:51] this world.
[19:52] To show you the true meaning of
[19:55] compassion.
[19:56] Beginning with compassion for yourself,
[19:58] because without that, there's no
[19:59] compassion for anyone else.
[20:02] And then how to deploy
[20:04] compassion, which stems from a vastly
[20:06] open heart, without losing your F'ing
[20:08] mind.
[20:10] That's why we practice. Sure, we may
[20:12] start out practicing because we've got
[20:14] all these problems.
[20:15] Because I have stress and I have other
[20:18] issues and meditation might help me.
[20:20] Yeah, it might.
[20:21] But that's just the start. The next step
[20:23] is how can you help others?
[20:26] And any meditation tradition that does
[20:28] not emphasize that, this is why we're
[20:31] doing it, has been lost in the swamp of
[20:34] Western culture.
[20:35] So, lineage, very important. Not because
[20:38] anyone wants you to be any other
[20:40] religion or adopt beliefs, but because
[20:43] it's what gives the practice and the
[20:45] environment of the practice
[20:48] depth and gravitas and the ability to
[20:51] hold your experience
[20:54] 95% of the time, cuz there are always
[20:56] exceptions.
[20:58] I'm going to mention one in a moment.
[20:59] What is also necessary in constructing
[21:02] guardrails for your practice, which
[21:03] again, is your mind trying to to at your
[21:05] mind. That's a very nuanced, delicate
[21:08] thing. You don't want to just plop down
[21:10] and try to do that. You want some
[21:12] container, some infrastructure,
[21:14] some guardrails for doing so. So,
[21:16] lineage, as mentioned, is one.
[21:19] And the other is other folks,
[21:21] sanga, Sanskrit for community,
[21:24] to practice with others, whether you're
[21:27] in real time with them or you just know
[21:28] they're out there. We need each other.
[21:31] Meditation, of course, is a solitary
[21:33] pursuit. Most of us do it most of the
[21:36] time alone. That's fine.
[21:39] But every once in a while, to go and sit
[21:41] with others
[21:42] is very, very not just important, it's
[21:45] necessary for your practice to deepen.
[21:49] And I've talked about that in other
[21:50] episodes. I won't talk about why that is
[21:52] so.
[21:53] But for now, let's just say
[21:55] it's so. In my observation, my
[21:57] experience, and also according to the
[21:59] Buddha Dharma.
[22:00] So, as mentioned in the beginning,
[22:01] meditation does not quiet you. It
[22:04] amplifies the inner state.
[22:06] There could be utility in that,
[22:08] but only when these guardrails are very
[22:10] firm, and you have support, and you have
[22:14] guidance.
[22:15] Now, most of the meditation retreats
[22:17] that happen in our world, Western
[22:20] culture, are modeled on monastic
[22:24] retreats.
[22:25] I happen to love a monastic retreat.
[22:28] You go away from your life, you quiet
[22:30] down, and the retreats mentioned in
[22:33] these Atlantic articles, you zip your
[22:35] pie hole, you stop talking, not just to
[22:38] other people, but you stop communicating
[22:41] nonverbally.
[22:42] What do you think that does to the
[22:44] amplification?
[22:46] It makes it even louder. Further, in a
[22:49] monastic setting, you have a schedule.
[22:52] It's not hard to stick to, because
[22:53] everyone's doing it, so you just go
[22:55] along, and it's wonderful.
[22:56] I love it. I love retreats. I love
[22:58] teaching them, and I love being a
[22:59] student on retreats.
[23:01] However,
[23:02] when the retreat is over, we have to
[23:04] come home. And it can be quite jarring,
[23:07] especially after 10 days or 2 weeks or a
[23:10] month, cuz you're not coming back to a
[23:11] monastery. You're coming back to
[23:13] whatever the craziness of your
[23:15] particular world. As practitioners, we
[23:18] are what is called
[23:20] householders.
[23:21] There are three paths to enlightenment,
[23:23] at least in the Buddhist tradition I was
[23:25] trained in.
[23:27] The first is the monastic tradition.
[23:29] You go away, and you don't come back.
[23:32] You devote yourself to
[23:34] deep contemplation and realization. And
[23:37] you live in community, and you don't
[23:38] have bills, and you're probably not
[23:40] married, and
[23:41] you don't have to pick your outfit every
[23:43] day, it's picked out for you. And it's a
[23:45] quiet environment arranged
[23:48] to support deep inner seeing.
[23:51] That's great. However, that's just one
[23:53] of three.
[23:54] Second is called the wandering mendicant
[23:58] or a forest yogi, someone who goes out
[24:01] with a begging bowl or sits in a cave
[24:03] for
[24:04] 3 months or 3 years or 3 lifetimes, just
[24:08] calming all external inputs to focus
[24:12] exclusively on attainment of liberation.
[24:16] And you throw yourself on the mercy of
[24:19] the world to bring you food, deny you
[24:22] food, same with warmth, same with
[24:25] shelter. You just throw yourself on the
[24:28] winds of circumstance.
[24:30] Curiosity and commitment.
[24:32] But you don't have a family or bills or
[24:35] a lawn to mow, for example.
[24:38] So, you and I, my friends, I
[24:41] venture to guess, are not doing those
[24:43] paths. We're not monastics, and we're
[24:46] not sitting in a cave.
[24:48] We are the third type of practitioner
[24:50] called the householder.
[24:52] Someone who lives in a house,
[24:54] presumably,
[24:56] or lives somewhere, and has bills and
[24:59] relationships and
[25:01] messes and outfits and problems and
[25:04] money worries and all the things that we
[25:06] have.
[25:07] When you exit the householder life and
[25:10] enter the monastic life without
[25:13] transition
[25:14] and then when you exit similarly without
[25:17] transition
[25:18] it can be very jarring. Just to reuse
[25:21] that word.
[25:22] So, it's important when you go on a
[25:24] retreat should you go on one and I hope
[25:26] you will because they're awesome to not
[25:28] deep dive into a monastic experience.
[25:31] That's my advice.
[25:33] But to deep dive into meditation
[25:35] practice with a sense of other human
[25:37] being around you who are rooting for
[25:40] you, a teacher who is caring about you,
[25:42] meals that are shared with quiet
[25:45] conversation
[25:47] human beings that you can sense around
[25:50] you, people you can talk to.
[25:52] Not gibber-jabber to
[25:54] but when meditation sessions are
[25:56] concluded
[25:58] there's some sense of
[25:59] we're doing this together.
[26:01] Someone cares about me and what I'm
[26:03] experiencing.
[26:05] We need that.
[26:06] Human beings need that, but householders
[26:08] entering a monastic setting need it
[26:11] particularly, otherwise it can be
[26:13] disorienting.
[26:14] The last thing I'll say is that
[26:16] if this is you
[26:18] please try to stop doing this.
[26:20] There can be a macho way of looking at
[26:24] deep retreat.
[26:26] Like I'm going to conquer something. I'm
[26:28] going to bust through something. I'm
[26:31] going to expose and dispense of
[26:34] something. These are violent aggressive
[26:36] terms.
[26:37] And if I can sit there and zip it for 10
[26:40] days or 5 days or whatever it is, I will
[26:43] have accomplished something. Well, maybe
[26:45] you will, but the fact that you did it
[26:47] is not an indication of such.
[26:49] Or I'm going to go sit in the dark.
[26:52] Dark retreats are an ancient, powerful,
[26:56] profound part of Vajrayana Buddhism, the
[26:59] tradition that I was trained in. So, in
[27:01] no way am I casting aspersions on dark
[27:03] retreat. I've never done one.
[27:05] But, my guess is if you enter one
[27:07] without a lot
[27:10] of preparation, and by preparation I
[27:12] mean
[27:13] decades, years at least,
[27:16] of practice
[27:17] with a teacher, a dark retreat, which is
[27:20] what you might imagine if you've never
[27:22] heard of it. You're on a meditation
[27:23] retreat, but dark. All the windows are
[27:25] blocked, or you're sitting in a tiny
[27:26] room by yourself with no light. I can
[27:30] imagine that that is a profound
[27:32] preparation for the dying process.
[27:34] I can also imagine that if you just go,
[27:36] "Oh, that sounds like really hard. I
[27:38] want to do that and master it." That
[27:40] could be a really bad idea. Leave any
[27:44] macho wish to accomplish at the door.
[27:47] So, to conclude, I would say the dark
[27:49] night
[27:51] uh
[27:52] meditation, or the dark side of
[27:55] mindfulness, could more easily or
[27:57] correctly be called the dark side of
[28:00] aggression
[28:02] within spiritual practice.
[28:04] The dark side of entering an ancient
[28:08] tradition without guidance,
[28:11] and then expecting yourself to make
[28:14] sense of it.
[28:15] And if you can't, to despair. Or the
[28:18] dark side of trying to do it all by
[28:21] yourself, without wisdom tradition to
[28:24] hold you, would have been a more
[28:26] accurate title for these articles that
[28:29] issue warnings that are very important,
[28:32] but a little hollow at the same time.
[28:41] Now, for the podcast after party, where
[28:44] I play a song that I love and tell you
[28:46] why I love it, and hope that you will
[28:48] love it, too.
[28:49] So, the track that I want to play for
[28:50] you in this episode is called Think, t h
[28:54] i n k, as recorded by a group that
[28:58] started in the '40s
[28:59] and recorded into the mid-'60s called
[29:02] The Five Royales.
[29:04] The Five Royales
[29:06] were very important band in the history
[29:09] of rock and roll, in my opinion, and not
[29:12] just mine, other people think this, too.
[29:14] They were one of the first bridges
[29:17] of gospel into rock and roll. And part
[29:20] of what made that bridge so magnetizing
[29:23] was the sound of the guitar and the
[29:26] genius of the guitar player of The Five
[29:30] Royales, who's also the main songwriter,
[29:32] named Lowman Pauling, l o w m a n,
[29:36] Pauling, Lowman Pauling. I could say
[29:38] things about his guitar sound, but
[29:40] you'll hear it, and that'll be much
[29:41] better than anything I could say, but
[29:43] it's
[29:44] dinging
[29:45] and responsive in a way that guitar was
[29:50] not usually played back then. Again, I'm
[29:53] not a musician, not a guitar player.
[29:55] However, until sometime in the '50s,
[29:58] guitar was a rhythm instrument. It was
[30:01] not a lead instrument. If you look at
[30:03] old movies with bands and there's a
[30:05] guitar player, they're keeping the beat.
[30:07] They're not stepping out and soloing
[30:08] like sax players or trumpet players or
[30:11] piano players. Guitarists were in the
[30:14] background. The way Lowman Pauling
[30:16] played guitar, he Of course, he wasn't
[30:18] the first, but it brought the guitar
[30:20] right up front, and it made it central
[30:22] to the song. It's particularly notable
[30:25] in the composition called Think, which
[30:27] you may have heard because other people
[30:29] have recorded it like I think Mick
[30:31] Jagger. Lowman Pauling influenced a
[30:34] number of exceptional guitar players,
[30:37] one of whom was named Eric Clapton. I
[30:39] read that in an interview, anyway. And
[30:42] also, the great
[30:44] and probably not a very nice person, I
[30:46] don't know. But, not to cast aspersions
[30:49] on the greatness of his guitar playing,
[30:50] Steve Cropper, who came to fame in
[30:53] Booker T and the MGs in the late '60s, I
[30:56] think it was. Could have been mid-'60s.
[30:58] Steve Cropper produced a tribute album
[31:00] to the Five Royales, you know, 20 years
[31:02] ago or something, because of his love
[31:05] for their style and the sound of Lowman
[31:08] Pauling's guitar. So, have a listen.
[31:10] And please enjoy and respect the
[31:13] greatness of Lowman Pauling and the Five
[31:16] Royales. See you next time.
[31:21] >> Think.
[31:23] Think.
[31:25] Think.
[31:26] Think about the sacrifices
[31:29] that I made for you.
[31:33] Think of all the times
[31:37] that I spent with you.
[31:41] Think of all the good things
[31:45] that I done for you.
[31:48] Think of all the bad things
[31:52] I tried not to do.
[31:55] So, come on, baby, and
[31:57] >> Think.
[31:59] Think.
[32:01] Think.
[32:03] Think about THE GOOD THINGS.
[32:05] >> THINK.
[32:06] THINK.
[32:08] THINK.
[32:10] THINK ABOUT THE RIGHT THINGS.
[32:12] >> THINK.
[32:14] THINK.
[32:16] THINK.
[32:18] Think about THE BEST THINGS. AND MAYBE
[32:20] before you leave me, you realize
[32:23] I'm the one that loved you.
[32:49] >> How much of all your happiness
[32:53] have I really claimed?
[32:57] How many tears have you cried?
[33:01] For which of us is to blame?
[33:05] No, I can't remember
[33:08] which was my fault.
[33:12] I tried so hard to please you.
[33:16] At least that's what I thought.
[33:19] So, come on, sugar, and think.
[33:23] Think.
[33:25] Think.
[33:26] Think. ABOUT THE GOOD THINGS. THINK.
[33:30] THINK.
[33:32] THINK.
[33:34] ABOUT THE RIGHT THINGS. THINK.
[33:38] THINK.
[33:40] THINK.
[33:42] About the best things. And maybe before
[33:45] you leave me, you'll realize I'm the one
[33:48] to love you.